The Official 2020-2021 Hot Stove Offseason Thread

[Angels Fan Forever]

14 minutes ago, totdprods said:

The Padres’ trades might be beneficial to the Angels in that, in an offseason where few teams seem to be really interested in aggressively improving or spending money or prospects, takes one more team out of the mix, and the prices given up for both arms weren’t devastating to their (superior) farm. For the Angels all we need is a a really good SP trade and a savvy FA SP signing and we’re in solid shape.

I agree. I think this is the key takeaway for the Angels from the Padres trade for Darvish and what the Angels still need to do with their starting pitching.

[totdprods]

Personally, I have always rolled my eyes at any suggestion of Realmuto over the years, but I’m starting to get to a point where I wonder if lack of consistency or stability behind the plate is detrimental to developing some rhythm and consistency on the mound. And also, devoting time and resources into acquiring catching every offseason is taking away from other aspects.

As such, I’m at a point now where I would be okay with Realmuto, provided it makes sense in a bigger picture. The Angels likely have the money and trade currency to add Realmuto and still add two pitchers - one could be high impact if they part with Adell. 

[Angels in 2030]

Sorry, but i'm a big "No" in the Realmuto side of things.  Nothing will persuade me otherwise.  

[mmc]

 

[angelsnationtalk]

1 hour ago, totdprods said:

Personally, I have always rolled my eyes at any suggestion of Realmuto over the years, but I’m starting to get to a point where I wonder if lack of consistency or stability behind the plate is detrimental to developing some rhythm and consistency on the mound. And also, devoting time and resources into acquiring catching every offseason is taking away from other aspects.

As such, I’m at a point now where I would be okay with Realmuto, provided it makes sense in a bigger picture. The Angels likely have the money and trade currency to add Realmuto and still add two pitchers - one could be high impact if they part with Adell. 

I feel the same way. Realmuto is a good option at catcher for a few years then could do well at 1B. He's played there before so it's not new to him. If this would be the case then they'd have to seriously consider moving Adell for an Ace under control with low $. It'd have to be Castillo. Even then, Realmuto takes a lot of spending away from where we need it. 

[totdprods]

18 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

I feel the same way. Realmuto is a good option at catcher for a few years then could do well at 1B. He's played there before so it's not new to him. If this would be the case then they'd have to seriously consider moving Adell for an Ace under control with low $. It'd have to be Castillo. Even then, Realmuto takes a lot of spending away from where we need it. 

Don’t have to emphasize drafting college catchers, don’t have to try and match up on a budget every year with whichever free agent is available cheap, don’t have to trade for one when they’re hard to come by...

He was never someone I understood the hype for, but depending on how Arte spends and how other moves are made to address pitching this season and next, I can see an Angels team with Realmuto involved that makes sense. 

I’d still prefer some combo of Bauer/Castillo, Musgrove/Gray, and Suzuki. 

Edited December 29, 2020 by totdprods

[Second Base]

I remember telling everyone that would listen that the Angels signing Pujols was a pipe dream, never going to happen. I laughed at the people that thought the Angels would allow Torii Hunter to walk. No way. I scoffed at the thought that they'd double down and sign Josh Hamilton to a big contract. I also said the Angels wouldn't be in on Simmons because they already had Erick Aybar. I didn't take anyone seriously when they suggested the Angels sign Anthony Rendon last winter when pitching was so clearly a need, as it always is. 

JT Realmuto would not address the Angels needs, and is absolutely the type of acquisition they've made time and again.

So, I guess that means we are getting JT Realmuto.

[totdprods]

13 minutes ago, Second Base said:

JT Realmuto would not address the Angels needs, and is absolutely the type of acquisition they've made time and again.

So, I guess that means we are getting JT Realmuto.

If it happened, I see a couple scenarios still...

1) They still sign Bauer, and both he and Realmuto’s contracts are significantly backloaded, at least for ‘21, Arte goes over budget for a year, they don’t really bring anyone else in, and they hold off any major adds until both Pujols and Upton drop off. This would be a good way to bank on the work Eppler did and rely on the farm coming through the next two seasons to fill needs. If Minasian feels the minor league pipeline does indeed have the talent to handle this, I could see it happening. 

2) They go hard after Castillo or another SP making very little financially. With that flexibility, they might still have a bit of cash to spread $5-10m AAV out between one or two (or three very cheap) more SP, a RF, or RP. This is probably the most palatable avenue to the board if we signed JT, so probably also the least likeliest. 

3) They sign Realmuto, someone like Odorizzi or Tanaka in the $9-$15m AAV range, swing a trade for someone cheap ($5m or less) like Musgrove - or Castillo - and make no further moves and go slightly over. Depending on Arte’s pockets, this offseason could mean several vets take one-year, underpaid deals for ‘21. If that ties in with deals involving Adell or Fletcher, they could roll the dice on one year deals. Wong? Pillar? Joc? Some form of this is probably the likeliest.

Edited December 29, 2020 by totdprods

[Angel Oracle]

2 hours ago, totdprods said:

Personally, I have always rolled my eyes at any suggestion of Realmuto over the years, but I’m starting to get to a point where I wonder if lack of consistency or stability behind the plate is detrimental to developing some rhythm and consistency on the mound. And also, devoting time and resources into acquiring catching every offseason is taking away from other aspects.

As such, I’m at a point now where I would be okay with Realmuto, provided it makes sense in a bigger picture. The Angels likely have the money and trade currency to add Realmuto and still add two pitchers - one could be high impact if they part with Adell. 

I am coming somewhat on board with this.

BUT, they still need to add at least one solid #3 starter like Odorizzi or Tanaka, if signing Realmuto.  No more stop gaps like Harvey, Cahill, Blanton, Nolasco, etc.!!!!

I may be in the minority when saying that Heaney MAY have turned a bit of a corner in 2020.  HRs allowed were way down and the WHIP was solid enough to be a tweener (#3/#4 starter).

Prefer to not trade key prospects for another year.  Hopefully by a year from now, that begins to change.

I am tiring of the catcher musical chairs.

Edited December 29, 2020 by Angel Oracle

[totdprods]

Just now, Angel Oracle said:

I am coming on board with this.

BUT, they still need to add at least one solid #3 starter like Odorizzi or Tanaka.

Prefer to not trade key prospects for another year.  Hopefully by a year from now, that begins to change.

I think it could be doable. One benefit in signing Realmuto and someone mid-tier like Odorizzi or Tanaka is you can spread out a bit of the financial impact on ‘21. That could give them enough flexibility to still cash in on someone like Musgrove or even Castillo, guys who won’t make more than $5m in ‘21.

This team is so top-heavy financially now and for the next couple of seasons. It’s Trout, Rendon, Pujols, Upton and basically a bunch of low-arb/league minimum guys, most of whom aren’t significantly contributing. 

If Minasian can even it out a bit - turn a couple league minimum guys into someone like Musgrove - and then fill out MLB needs with MLB vet role players - it could help balance things a bit. Not unlike what he did with the bullpen, turning six guys makes $12m into three - Iglesias, Claudio, and Rivera - making $9m. It’s a balancing act.

[Erstad Grit]

10 minutes ago, totdprods said:

If it happened, I see a couple scenarios still...

1) They still sign Bauer, and both he and Realmuto’s contracts are significantly backloaded, at least for ‘21, Arte goes over budget for a year, they don’t really bring anyone else in, and they hold off any major adds until both Pujols and Upton drop off. This would be a good way to bank on the work Eppler did and rely on the farm coming through the next two seasons to fill needs. If Minasian feels the minor league pipeline does indeed have the talent to handle this, I could see it happening. 

2) They go hard after Castillo or another SP making very little financially. With that flexibility, they might still have a bit of cash to spread $5-10m AAV out between one or two (or three very cheap) more SP, a RF, or RP. This is probably the most palatable avenue to the board if we signed JT, so probably also the least likeliest. 

3) They sign Realmuto, someone like Odorizzi or Tanaka in the $9-$15m AAV range, swing a trade for someone cheap ($5m or less) like Musgrove - or Castillo - and make no further moves and go slightly over. Depending on Arte’s pockets, this offseason could mean several vets take one-year, underpaid deals for ‘21. If that ties in with deals involving Adell or Fletcher, they could roll the dice on one year deals. Wong? Pillar? Joc? Some form of this is probably the likeliest.

I'd be fn stoked if we added

Castillo

Realmuto

Odorizzi

Joc

and I'd give up Adell and almost any non-pitching prospect but Marsh

[Angel Oracle]

I’d gladly settle for trading for Gray, and signing Odorizzi/Tanaka, Realmuto, Pillar, and Bradley.

[Erstad Grit]

Just now, Angel Oracle said:

I’d gladly settle for trading for Gray, and signing Odorizzi/Tanaka, Realmuto, Pillar, and Bradley.

Sonny not John correct?

[Angel Oracle]

7 minutes ago, Erstad Grit said:

Sonny not John correct?

Correct, still has 2 or 3 years left for either $21 million or $32 million.

That would put Arte about $20 million over tax threshold with my thought.   Frees up $24 million after 2021.   Them re-signs Bundy if still pitching well, and back under tax threshold after 2022 thanks to Upton’s salary freed up.

They have Bundy, Gray, Odorizzi/Tanaka, Heaney, and Canning with Barria/Ohtani for depth.

They would have a solid trio late in games (Iglesias, Mayers, and Bradley).

The lineup would be solid, and finally have a long term catching solution.

Fletcher, Pillar, Trout, Rendon, Realmuto, Ohtani, Upton, Walsh/Pujols, and Iglesias 

Edited December 29, 2020 by Angel Oracle

[Hubs]

4 minutes ago, Erstad Grit said:

I'd be fn stoked if we added

Castillo

Realmuto

Odorizzi

Joc

and I'd give up Adell and almost any non-pitching prospect but Marsh

One of those guys is not like the others. Lol. Odorozzi is so overrated by the members of this board. He’s gonna get 15-17M a year annually too. For a guy that was injured all year last year basically. 

Castillo will cost Adell, Marsh, Detmers and probably Sandoval or Jackson. Would decimate the farm. But he has three years of control under arbitration.

Steeeep price.

Realmuto is the best catcher in baseball.

Joc is a near perfect platoon partner for Ward.

[totdprods]

10 minutes ago, Erstad Grit said:

I'd be fn stoked if we added

Castillo

Realmuto

Odorizzi

Joc

and I'd give up Adell and almost any non-pitching prospect but Marsh

That could almost be done...

Castillo will land between $3-$6m this winter in arb.

Realmuto presumably around $20m AAV. 

Odorizzi presumably around $10-13m AAV.

Joc? $6m? $11m? Hard to gauge. 

If we have ~$30m left (the bullpen non-tenders equal out closely with Iglesias x2 and Claudio), that’s around ~$40m depending on how some things are structured. Pretty unlikely but not totally unrealistic. Castillo would be the only one costing prospects and Adell would make up a big part of that. 

 

[Angel Oracle]

5 minutes ago, Hubs said:

One of those guys is not like the others. Lol. Odorozzi is so overrated by the members of this board. He’s gonna get 15-17M a year annually too. For a guy that was injured all year last year basically. 

Castillo will cost Adell, Marsh, Detmers and probably Sandoval or Jackson. Would decimate the farm. But he has three years of control under arbitration.

Steeeep price.

Realmuto is the best catcher in baseball.

Joc is a near perfect platoon partner for Ward.

How about Tanaka instead of Odorizzi?   He’s been pretty durable the past 6+ seasons, and is only 32 in 2021.

Agree that Castillo isn’t realistic, but Sonny Gray is.

Edited December 29, 2020 by Angel Oracle

[Hubs]

If not Bauer (6/180), Musgrove (3-4 Arb) Suzuki (2/7) and Joc (2/14)

I think I’d prefer 

Realmuto (5/120),  Taijuan Walker (2/16), Sonny Gray (3/32) and Joc (2/14)

Id also still look at adding a power lefty for the pen in each of these scenarios.

[mmc]

 

[Hubs]

Just now, Hubs said:

If not Bauer (6/180), Musgrove (3-4 Arb) Suzuki (2/7) and Joc (2/14)

I think I’d prefer 

Realmuto (5/120),  Taijuan Walker (2/16), Sonny Gray (3/32) and Joc (2/14)

Id also still look at adding a power lefty for the pen in each of these scenarios.

And you can do it by getting Bauer or Realmuto to take a smaller base in 2021, maybe 20 in Bauer’s case and 15 in Realmuto’s. (20+25+31+34+35+35 = 180). Or (16/24/24/28/28)

[southpaw]

Hey we got Juan Graterol again.  w00h00!!  Catching has been done now. Lol

[Hubs]

Cubs are shopping Contreras.

 

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, southpaw said:

Hey we got Juan Graterol again.  w00h00!!  Catching has been done now. Lol

I would be perfectly comfortable if we went into the season with those three catchers we have on the roster, if it meant we were going to acquire pitching.

[Stradling]

Just now, Hubs said:

Cubs are shopping Contreras.

 

Not interested unless it is a deal that would be expanded to include Hendricks.  I don’t want to use prospect capital to acquire a catcher.  

[Hubs]

2 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Not interested unless it is a deal that would be expanded to include Hendricks.  I don’t want to use prospect capital to acquire a catcher.  

The two of them would cost Adell and maybe like Jackson and a low level flier. 
 

Without Adell I don’t think you can get it done.