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The Official 2020-2021 Hot Stove Offseason Thread


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4 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Paxton's velocity took a huge dive this past year. Could be an outlier, but his health is always in question.

Honestly I don't think he's even an option for Perry, but of course I could be wrong.

We really need stability. You can't predict health but when signing a guy with an injury history like Paxton, you kinda knew what you were getting if he misses 10-15 starts.

This is a fair criticism, but FWIW, from 2017-2019, he made 24, 28, and 29 stars.  While that isn't amazing, it's not like he missed half or even a third of the season - he made a pretty good amount of starts.

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I think you meant to tag Arte Moreno. 

How I feel getting a post in before you

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4 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

The Angels can't sign Bauer if he only wants one year. We already have 3 starters possibly leaving in 2022. If we have 4 we're in a really bad spot. 

Unfortunately it's looking like Odorizzi is the best option. Ugh.

I’m more liking the thought that if Bauer would take two years for $70-$80 million, do it.

Then by 2023, assuming at least Bundy is extended, you still have Bundy, Canning, Detmers, CRod, Barria, and Ohtani.

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5 minutes ago, Warfarin said:

Bingo, and that's exactly what I think we'll see Minasian look for - a short-term, incentive-laden deal for a SP.  Kinda like what Quintana got - a one year, "prove it" type deal.

Still not worth it.   Quintana isn't anywhere near the injury risk Paxton is -- he's got nowhere near the upside either but, betting on potential upside while ignoring risk is how they ended up signing Harvey and crossing their fingers that the PRP treatment on Richards would take.   Tanaka is another guy that brings upside but there are legit concerns about his ability to stay healthy.

Doesn't matter if they don't waste money if because of yet another injury they don't improve the team -- that should be their goal.   They need to make as many moves as they can to win more games.  If that means three guys or one great guy, whatever.   

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6 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Still not worth it.   Quintana isn't anywhere near the injury risk Paxton is -- he's got nowhere near the upside either but, betting on potential upside while ignoring risk is how they ended up signing Harvey and crossing their fingers that the PRP treatment on Richards would take.   Tanaka is another guy that brings upside but there are legit concerns about his ability to stay healthy.

Doesn't matter if they don't waste money if because of yet another injury they don't improve the team -- that should be their goal.   They need to make as many moves as they can to win more games.  If that means three guys or one great guy, whatever.   

And Quintana has maintained velocity.

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Just now, Angel Oracle said:

And Quintana has maintained velocity.

Like I said in a previous post..  I'm not hoping for him to revert to his CWS level goodness.  After all we have dealt with the last half decade, simply being what he's been the last four or so years would be nice.  A league average starter than can be counted on to go 6 innings every time out seems like a freaking gift from above at this point.

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7 minutes ago, rafibomb said:

But the updated story now is:

Every fucking team in the league is mentioned except the Angels.

How come it's never, "Angels in the mix"

or

"Angels increasing focus"

instead it's

"Mets, Dodgers, Twins, and Jays"

"oops sorry, not the Twins, just Mets, Dodgers and Jays"

 

 

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1 minute ago, Inside Pitch said:

Like I said in a previous post..  I'm not hoping for him to revert to his CWS level goodness.  After all we have dealt with the last half decade, simply being what he's been the last four or so years would be nice.  A league average starter than can be counted on to go 6 innings every time out seems like a freaking gift from above at this point.

Yup. 6 solid innings of 4 to 5 run ball hoping the offense carries the whole things. 
Seems like the exact thing the Angels love..... Which has worked so well.....

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1 minute ago, Jay said:

Every fucking team in the league is mentioned except the Angels.

How come it's never, "Angels in the mix"

or

"Angels increasing focus"

instead it's

"Mets, Dodgers, Twins, and Jays"

"oops sorry, not the Twins, just Mets, Dodgers and Jays"

 

 

I can only think that it's because Angels camp and Bauer camp are both extremely private about negotiations it seems like. 

We never saw any indications that the Angels were in discussions with Quintana, Suzuki, or the Reds for the trades they made. IF they are in on Bauer then I wouldn't expect there to be any word on that either. 

That or Arte doesn't want an ace

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This new flood of information has all the signs of his agent leaking things because maybe he knows who he wants to play for, but he’s not getting the offer he wants. No news for weeks, if not more, and all of a sudden we’ve heard the Dodgers, Blue Jays, and Mets all within days. Rosenthal even weirdly brought up the Twins, until someone put him in his place immediately after he reported it.

 

To me, it’s not much different than when Heyman or some other idiot brings up “mystery teams” being involved on a free agent when that player isn’t getting what he wants.

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4 minutes ago, Jay said:

Every fucking team in the league is mentioned except the Angels.

How come it's never, "Angels in the mix"

or

"Angels increasing focus"

instead it's

"Mets, Dodgers, Twins, and Jays"

"oops sorry, not the Twins, just Mets, Dodgers and Jays"

 

 

The Angels operate in stealth mode.  We didn't hear a single link to Quintana until we signed him.  That's just how Arte prefers the team operates.

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3 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

Yup. 6 solid innings of 4 to 5 run ball hoping the offense carries the whole things. 
Seems like the exact thing the Angels love..... Which has worked so well.....

6 innings of 4 to 5 runs would amount to a 6.00 ERA at it's best or 7.50 at it's worst -- on what planet would that bare minimum 6.00 ERA be league average?

Go be stupid in response to someone else's comments.  

 

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1 minute ago, Inside Pitch said:

6 innings of 4 to 5 runs would amount to a 6.00 ERA at it's best -- on what planet would that bare minimum 6.00 ERA be league average?

Go be stupid in response to someone else's comments.  

 

Quintana will live around 3-6 runs per game where he will pitching 4-7 innings in them. At the end of the day it'll be around there. 

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I was honestly not interested in Quintana before and, stupidly, compared him to Teheran without considering the facts. I'm not even close to having the knowledge @Inside Pitch does, or @Dochalo, or many others. But I do follow trends and look at more than the base stats. 

Quintana isn't going to be a great pitcher but it's likely he will be good. Semantics aside, Quintana has posted positive ERA+ and FIP numbers in 3 of the last 4 years. He will benefit from pitching away from Chicago, I think.

I'm looking at 2018 Heaney as an expectation for him. That would be huge.

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3 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

I was honestly not interested in Quintana before and, stupidly, compared him to Teheran without considering the facts. I'm not even close to having the knowledge @Inside Pitch does, or @Dochalo, or many others. But I do follow trends and look at more than the base stats. 

Quintana isn't going to be a great pitcher but it's likely he will be good. Semantics aside, Quintana has posted positive ERA+ and FIP numbers in 3 of the last 4 years. He will benefit from pitching away from Chicago, I think.

I'm looking at 2018 Heaney as an expectation for him. That would be huge.

And consider - not including 2020, the fewest number of starts he has made in a season since 2013 was 31.  He made somewhere between 31-33 starts every year from 2013-2019.  That's huge.

Between him and Bundy, we have at least two guys that can likely make most/all of their starts this year.

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8 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

Quintana will live around 3-6 runs per game where he will pitching 4-7 innings in them. At the end of the day it'll be around there. 

Congratulations, you are now the baseball message board version of Nickelback. You've changed the order of the words around but you're still saying the same thing.  

Hail Canada!

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10 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Quintana isn't going to be a great pitcher but it's likely he will be good. Semantics aside, Quintana has posted positive ERA+ and FIP numbers in 3 of the last 4 years. He will benefit from pitching away from Chicago, I think.

Again, it's not even about being good -- just being league average would be a boon.  To pretend that's what the Angels have been getting from their FA signs the last few years is ludicrous beyond words.

Now, if people want to argue he's not capable of doing that -- fine, nothing is guaranteed and there was at least ONE reason to look at him with some trepidation.  But this notion that he's going to be a 6-7.50 ERA guy just lacks any semblance of logic.   

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3 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Again, it's not even about being good -- just being league average would be a boon.  To pretend that's what the Angels have been getting from their FA signs the last few years is ludicrous beyond words.

Now, if people want to argue he's not capable of doing that -- fine, nothing is guaranteed and there was at least ONE reason to look at him with some trepidation.  But this notion that he's going to be a 6-7.50 ERA guy just lacks any semblance of logic.   

Quintana making regular starts means we can avoid seeing starts from guys like Dilon Peters and whomever else we would find off the scrap heap.

As you said, having some pitchers who can consistently make starts, even if those starts are league average to slightly above league average, does hold value because it means we avoid having to tap into our rather poor SP depth.

Bundy and Quintana, at the least, should be able to be counted on to make most of their starts.  Heaney and Canning, probably not so much.

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