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Holy Hell, Trevor Bauer!


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This is really, really gay. It's January 11th you fuckin attention whore. Sign with somebody.

🧸🥞👀

Nicely done @John Taylor  

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Please, it's obvious what this is about. The Angels FO/Arte are doing damage control. Either they were never going to sign Bauer or they've decided it's just too much. Regardless, Arte isn't gonna spend the money, so they leaked out a nonsensical story to the Times that was in the news a few years ago as an excuse why they just can't sign him. Coincidentally, this excuse gives them deniability from looking cheap, which, even though it would be pushing the budget, a lot of fans will see it as. 

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2 minutes ago, Pancake Bear said:

Please, it's obvious what this is about. The Angels FO/Arte are doing damage control. Either they were never going to sign Bauer or they've decided it's just too much. Regardless, Arte isn't gonna spend the money, so they leaked out a nonsensical story to the Times that was in the news a few years ago as an excuse why they just can't sign him. Coincidentally, this excuse gives them deniability from looking cheap, which, even though it would be pushing the budget, a lot of fans will see it as. 

No.

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4 minutes ago, Pancake Bear said:

Please, it's obvious what this is about. The Angels FO/Arte are doing damage control. Either they were never going to sign Bauer or they've decided it's just too much. Regardless, Arte isn't gonna spend the money, so they leaked out a nonsensical story to the Times that was in the news a few years ago as an excuse why they just can't sign him. Coincidentally, this excuse gives them deniability from looking cheap, which, even though it would be pushing the budget, a lot of fans will see it as. 

the tin foil hat crew is back!

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1 hour ago, Pancake Bear said:

Keep drinking the kool-aid. 

Bro, say what you will about the Angels/Arte they just haven't done that sort of shit during his ownership. Time and again when something like this has happened they have reverted to the whole we have a budget, we will do something if it makes sense/if its the right player.  That's been an efficient catch-all response/excuse that both answered questions while being vague enough to leave fans frustrated -- it's pretty much defined the Arte era and their decision making.

I just have a hard time believing this is what's happening, and if indeed it is happening, then I'd say its an ugly precedent and a reason for worry about Minasian's front office.....so, I refuse to believe its as "obvious" as you think.

We have already had a front office that leaked propaganda to the media once... I want none of it.

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6 hours ago, Inside Pitch said:

Lastly -- Sandoval hasn't done it yet, but he's quietly done some peripheral stuff that makes one believe he's a solid candidate for breakout.  He's one of like 8 pitchers in all of MLB to have elite level K percentages with two pitches.  He's not someone you can consider a sure thing or view as a core piece but he's a world better than he's shown early on.

Are you referring to the changeup and slider? I feel like Sandoval can greatly benefit from a similar pitch distribution as Bundy. Sandoval threw his fastball 44.6% of the time while Bundy threw his 33.6% of the time (42.4% in 2019 with Baltimore). Even Sandoval's curveball is in the 79th percentile in spin rate and he only threw it 7% of the time. There is a good pitcher in Sandoval somewhere, but I don't know what needs to happen for it to finally click.

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11 minutes ago, rafibomb said:

Are you referring to the changeup and slider? I feel like Sandoval can greatly benefit from a similar pitch distribution as Bundy. Sandoval threw his fastball 44.6% of the time while Bundy threw his 33.6% of the time (42.4% in 2019 with Baltimore). Even Sandoval's curveball is in the 79th percentile in spin rate and he only threw it 7% of the time. There is a good pitcher in Sandoval somewhere, but I don't know what needs to happen for it to finally click.

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So yeah - that's the list and a reason to still dream on Sandoval...   He's thrown what -- 80 MLB innings, the kid is a work in progress.  When Minasian talks about the importance of catchers and sequencing etc etc...  this is the sort of stuff that comes to mind.

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10 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Essq8QIXEAAy8iA?format=jpg&name=medium

So yeah - that's the list and a reason to still dream on Sandoval...   He's thrown what -- 80 MLB innings, the kid is a work in progress.  When Minasian talks about the importance of catchers and sequencing etc etc...  this is the sort of stuff that comes to mind.

 

Quite a list of names for him to be a part of. I am curious and gna look into how many of those guys have a below-average fastball like him (in terms of spin). Looks like Marquez is in the 23rd percentile. Sandoval was my breakout choice for the 2020 season and I am picking him again for 2021. 

 

 

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25 minutes ago, rafibomb said:

 

Quite a list of names for him to be a part of. I am curious and gna look into how many of those guys have a below-average fastball like him (in terms of spin). Looks like Marquez is in the 23rd percentile. Sandoval was my breakout choice for the 2020 season and I am picking him again for 2021. 

 

 

Yup, 100%....  How many times have we seen this guy dealing then fall apart?  His change is getting plus results and yet still getting below average pitch values.  Its all pitch mix/sequencing with him.  

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In terms of prospects, etc - I think the key thing is Minasian likely recognizes that we have an "okay" farm system with potential.  It is by no means a bad farm system, but it isn't a top one either.  To do what the Padres did this offseason, or some other teams, we likely need to continue to build our prospect pipeline, not subtract from it.

My guess is Minasian intends to utilize the FA market to find another SP.  He found Quintana, who isn't exciting but is likely very dependable and should be a solid SP3 type pitcher, at a great value of 1/8.  Maybe he gets an Odorizzi or a Paxton to complete the picture.  No ace, but that should, at least, give us a stable of solid SPs, which is definitely quite an improvement upon what we saw before.

And by doing that, we keep the payroll fairly clear for big additions in future years, while buying our farm system a year of development time.  This year, we should be able to see whether CRod can stay healthy all year and develop well, how close Detmers will be to joining the rotation, etc.  We do have a lot of intriguing prospects, but outside of Adell and Marsh, none have had quite enough development time to be considered a top 100 prospect yet.

This is not a rebuilding year, but what it is, is a year to try to cobble together a contender with an undervalued free agency market, while giving us time to further build and strengthen our farm system.

If Minasian can complete the offseason by signing Paxton and, say, Joc Pederson, and perhaps finding an intriguing BP candidate, I would say we'd have a very competitive team:

2B Fletcher, 1B Walsh, CF Trout, 3B Rendon, RF Pederson, LF Upton, DH Ohtani, C Stassi, SS Iglesias

Bundy, Paxton, Heaney, Quintana, Canning, Ohtani, with Barria, Sandoval, Suarez as "next man up."

I would say this should be a very competitive team, and it would enable us to keep all our prospects and continue to build.  Yes - we are likely to see injuries to Paxton, Heaney, Canning, etc at various points - but having Barria, Sandoval, and Suarez should help fill those gaps, as all 3 have varying degrees of promise.  

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Finally got around to reading the SI article that Torres cites. https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/02/19/trevor-bauer-cleveland-indians-training-tools-twitter-controversy-cy-young

Seems to me like Bauer has the potential to be a pretty divisive character. Also interesting that his greatest supporter in AZ was Dipoto. I'd be happy if they stayed away from him. 

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2 hours ago, JAHV said:

Finally got around to reading the SI article that Torres cites. https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/02/19/trevor-bauer-cleveland-indians-training-tools-twitter-controversy-cy-young

Seems to me like Bauer has the potential to be a pretty divisive character. Also interesting that his greatest supporter in AZ was Dipoto. I'd be happy if they stayed away from him. 

Bruin.

 

 

Sorry, @Lou

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2 hours ago, Warfarin said:

In terms of prospects, etc - I think the key thing is Minasian likely recognizes that we have an "okay" farm system with potential.  It is by no means a bad farm system, but it isn't a top one either.  To do what the Padres did this offseason, or some other teams, we likely need to continue to build our prospect pipeline, not subtract from it.

My guess is Minasian intends to utilize the FA market to find another SP.  He found Quintana, who isn't exciting but is likely very dependable and should be a solid SP3 type pitcher, at a great value of 1/8.  Maybe he gets an Odorizzi or a Paxton to complete the picture.  No ace, but that should, at least, give us a stable of solid SPs, which is definitely quite an improvement upon what we saw before.

And by doing that, we keep the payroll fairly clear for big additions in future years, while buying our farm system a year of development time.  This year, we should be able to see whether CRod can stay healthy all year and develop well, how close Detmers will be to joining the rotation, etc.  We do have a lot of intriguing prospects, but outside of Adell and Marsh, none have had quite enough development time to be considered a top 100 prospect yet.

This is not a rebuilding year, but what it is, is a year to try to cobble together a contender with an undervalued free agency market, while giving us time to further build and strengthen our farm system.

If Minasian can complete the offseason by signing Paxton and, say, Joc Pederson, and perhaps finding an intriguing BP candidate, I would say we'd have a very competitive team:

2B Fletcher, 1B Walsh, CF Trout, 3B Rendon, RF Pederson, LF Upton, DH Ohtani, C Stassi, SS Iglesias

Bundy, Paxton, Heaney, Quintana, Canning, Ohtani, with Barria, Sandoval, Suarez as "next man up."

I would say this should be a very competitive team, and it would enable us to keep all our prospects and continue to build.  Yes - we are likely to see injuries to Paxton, Heaney, Canning, etc at various points - but having Barria, Sandoval, and Suarez should help fill those gaps, as all 3 have varying degrees of promise.  

I would worry about Paxson drop in velocity and sore forearm. Walker or Odorizzi

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26 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

I would worry about Paxson drop in velocity and sore forearm. Walker or Odorizzi

Right - I say Paxton on the condition that the FO feels he is healthy, given his recent session that was scouted.  Obviously if they are concerned about his health, then yeah - I would not want them to sign him.

There are options out there, and I am confident Minasian will find another SP.  We'll see who it is.

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37 minutes ago, oldguy said:

Steve Kornacki just reported that there is a 67% chance Angels fans will be breathing a sigh of relief over losing out on Bauer by Independence Day.

Ive been waiting for him to sign here and really wanting him to. But now Im sort of leaning towards bad move if we do.

If he is the 2020 guy, you can deal with the headaches he brings (if all that stuff is true). If hes more the 2019 version, with the headaches, and costing close to 40 a year, we would probably regret it.

We need pitching so bad, and have for so long, I think some of us (me included) are looking past some big red flags, daydreaming of finally having an ace.

This guy isnt sherzer or cole, etc. He was last year, but track record suggests otherwise

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6 hours ago, Warfarin said:

If Minasian can complete the offseason by signing Paxton and, say, Joc Pederson, and perhaps finding an intriguing BP candidate, I would say we'd have a very competitive team:

2B Fletcher, 1B Walsh, CF Trout, 3B Rendon, RF Pederson, LF Upton, DH Ohtani, C Stassi, SS Iglesias

Bundy, Paxton, Heaney, Quintana, Canning, Ohtani, with Barria, Sandoval, Suarez as "next man up."

I would say this should be a very competitive team, and it would enable us to keep all our prospects and continue to build.  Yes - we are likely to see injuries to Paxton, Heaney, Canning, etc at various points - but having Barria, Sandoval, and Suarez should help fill those gaps, as all 3 have varying degrees of promise.  

While Pederson would be a great addition to the team, I'm not sure that Minasian will be able to afford him with whatever budget he's been given.

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1 hour ago, oldguy said:

Steve Kornacki just reported that there is a 67% chance Angels fans will be breathing a sigh of relief over losing out on Bauer by Independence Day.

So that means there is a 48% chance that Angels fans will regret it and a 73% chance that this topic will become zombified on this forum never to die.

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1 hour ago, Trendon said:

While Pederson would be a great addition to the team, I'm not sure that Minasian will be able to afford him with whatever budget he's been given.

Sure, that's true.  It's hard to say how much he has left.

I know some want relievers, but just given how volatile relievers are year to year, I'd probably rather take a 1-2 year gamble on a SP (necessary risk for us) and get someone like Pederson, who will really help us on the corner OF spots as Adell and Marsh take more time to develop, and sign various under-the-radar relievers to minor league deals.

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