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Taylor Ward answer for RF 2021?


Angels 1961

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29 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

Many others besides me. 

Uh-huh....uh-huh, but "we" told "you" specifically what his issues were and "you" downplayed them all because "let Adel play".   So, knock the "we" talk off and wear it.  It's not like you're wrong to believe he'll become a good MLB player, its just that rankings are overrated when held up .vs actual results.  

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43 minutes ago, ScottT said:

Ward's gotta show some power at some point, too... to be an answer

You're right of course but its still good to see signs that he can resemble the player he's been in AAA.  He's played better the more he's played, hopefully they let him continue to get at bats and we see him continue to get comfortable.

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2 minutes ago, ScottT said:

Chill out on Adell. Geez.

Yep, he just wasn't ready.  He's 21, he's extremely talented, but he's  a work in progress. 

He's still exactly the same guy he was coming into this season, only now he knows MLB pitchers can't just be out-tooled. 

He's a smart kid, the humble pie may serve him well moving forward.

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Its fantastic. What we've seen from Walsh, Ward, and Upton is encouraging.

The Angels had so many guys doing so poorly.  It was only a matter of time before a couple were decent.  Those three have been much more... at least lately.

Thats the thing. Theyve got Trout and Rendon. Theyve got Fletcher.

The main problem with the Angels lately has been horrible performances. Just a couple decent players will make a nice difference 

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7 minutes ago, ScottT said:

Its fantastic. What we've seen from Walsh, Ward, and Upton is encouraging.

The Angels had so many guys doing so poorly.  It was only a matter of time before a couple were decent.  Those three have been much more... at least lately.

Thats the thing. Theyve got Trout and Rendon. Theyve got Fletcher.

The main problem with the Angels lately has been horrible performances. Just a couple decent players will make a nice difference 

Yep, the more pieces they can add to the foundation the better.  Barria looking like he can hold his own, Canning staying healthy, also big positives.  The reality they still have all their prospects in place is great too.  They got some crap to clean up still, but they are better off as a team if Walsh, Ward, Barria, and Canning all take that step forward.

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While I agree that you shouldn't put a ton of stock into small sample sizes, to me it means a lot more when a young player shows success in that small sample than if they struggle.  

If they struggle it means they've yet to start adjusting yet with additional reps or development, they still certainly can.  

Whereas with success, it shows that the player is now showing the capability of making the necessary adjustments when needed.  A huge step in development.  Pitchers are going to adjust again.  But it give more confidence that so can these hitters.  

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To add to what Doc said, it is one thing to have a good game or two, quite another to go on a torrid two-week stretch. It means something. 

Now it is very unlikely that Walsh hits anything like he has over a full season, but what we've seen these last 13 games shows us that he's a major league hitter.

Next year he could hit anything from .250/.300/.450 to .290/.350/.550, imo...that would be the range of likely performances, which is pretty wide. That means a mid-range over-under would be something like .270/.330/.500, which would be the best performance at 1B since Albert's first year. Again, just my opinion.

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31 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

To add to what Doc said, it is one thing to have a good game or two, quite another to go on a torrid two-week stretch. It means something. 

Now it is very unlikely that Walsh hits anything like he has over a full season, but what we've seen these last 13 games shows us that he's a major league hitter.

Next year he could hit anything from .250/.300/.450 to .290/.350/.550, imo...that would be the range of likely performances, which is pretty wide. That means a mid-range over-under would be something like .270/.330/.500, which would be the best performance at 1B since Albert's first year. Again, just my opinion.

an .800 ops with about 20-25 hr would be great.  Especially considering he's dirt cheap.  And he also plays very good 1b defense.  

I am most interested to see how Walsh adjusts next because they're gonna stop throwing him strikes at some point.  He's shown the ability to walk in the minors so he should be fine.  

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1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

an .800 ops with about 20-25 hr would be great.  Especially considering he's dirt cheap.  And he also plays very good 1b defense.  

I am most interested to see how Walsh adjusts next because they're gonna stop throwing him strikes at some point.  He's shown the ability to walk in the minors so he should be fine.  

Batting in front of Trout helps him. maybe if Adell batted in front never mind. 

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6 hours ago, ScottT said:

Its fantastic. What we've seen from Walsh, Ward, and Upton is encouraging.

The Angels had so many guys doing so poorly.  It was only a matter of time before a couple were decent.  Those three have been much more... at least lately.

Thats the thing. Theyve got Trout and Rendon. Theyve got Fletcher.

The main problem with the Angels lately has been horrible performances. Just a couple decent players will make a nice difference 

Right, that's the key thing.

A lot of people point out that it's rather baffling that we have 2 of the top position players in terms of fWAR (Trout, Rendon), 2 of the top pitchers (Bundy, Heaney), and a top 5 reliever (Mayers), and yet we're still only 21-30.

The problem is that we have received such awful performances on parts of our team that those awful performances have sunk us.

We know, moving forward, that Trout, Rendon, and Fletcher will be great, and that (hopefully) Bundy can continue to pitch as he has.  We just need to surround these guys with average to above average players, instead of sub-replacement level players.

Ward's "quiet" emergence this September has been encouraging.  It's unsustainable, based on his BABIP, but the most encouraging part is his BB% and K%.  Showing much improved contact and plate discipline is usually a great sign of a player making progress, and we can only hope that's what it means for Ward.

I don't think he is an answer in RF, but what I do think is he can likely be a very good utility player if he can continue to hone his ability to play multiple positions.  If he ends up being a guy who can be a 1-2 fWAR bench player who can fill in at LF/RF/3B/1B, that's a very useful player to have.

Hopefully, Thaiss can follow suit and be the left-handed version of Ward.

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^Agreed. Ward and a bunch of other guys don't have to be stars, just solid role players and/or quality regulars. A good team has some stars, but has a strong supporting cast comprised of a mix of impact players/borderline stars (e.g. Fletcher, Upton in a good year, this year's Bundy and Heaney), as well as quality regulars and role players - and no major holes. That last part is key. If players like Stassi, Walsh and Ward maintain even part of their current performance, it goes a long way to solidify the "floor" of the lineup. Hopefully next year we'll see at least one of Rengifo or Barreto make a similar jump, and a return to form from Ohtani, and we'll have a very potent lineup.

How about this (a plausible, if optimistic, scenario):

SS Fletcher .300/.370/.420, 10 HR, 5 WAR

1B Walsh .280/.350/.540, 28 HR, 4 WAR

CF Trout .300/.430/.650, 50 HR, 9 WAR

3B Rendon .300/.420/.550, 30 HR, 7 WAR

DH Ohtani .285/.340/.530, 20 HR, 3 WAR

LF Upton .250/.340/.460, 25 HR, 3 WAR

C Stassi .250/.330/.450, 15 HR, 3 WAR

RF Ward .280/.340/.420, 15 HR, 2 WAR

2B Rengifo .265/.350/.390, 5 HR, 2 WAR

To quote Funkadelic, "Can we get to that, I wanna know if we can get to that."

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Ward is a utility player at best. If Barreto can hit, he would immediately move past Ward on the depth charts because of his speed.  Ward is not a solution for anything at this point.  But it is nice he is not an automatic out like some others.

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1 hour ago, Angelsjunky said:

^Agreed. Ward and a bunch of other guys don't have to be stars, just solid role players and/or quality regulars. A good team has some stars, but has a strong supporting cast comprised of a mix of impact players/borderline stars (e.g. Fletcher, Upton in a good year, this year's Bundy and Heaney), as well as quality regulars and role players - and no major holes. That last part is key. If players like Stassi, Walsh and Ward maintain even part of their current performance, it goes a long way to solidify the "floor" of the lineup. Hopefully next year we'll see at least one of Rengifo or Barreto make a similar jump, and a return to form from Ohtani, and we'll have a very potent lineup.

How about this (a plausible, if optimistic, scenario):

SS Fletcher .300/.370/.420, 10 HR, 5 WAR

1B Walsh .280/.350/.540, 28 HR, 4 WAR

CF Trout .300/.430/.650, 50 HR, 9 WAR

3B Rendon .300/.420/.550, 30 HR, 7 WAR

DH Ohtani .285/.340/.530, 20 HR, 3 WAR

LF Upton .250/.340/.460, 25 HR, 3 WAR

C Stassi .250/.330/.450, 15 HR, 3 WAR

RF Ward .280/.340/.420, 15 HR, 2 WAR

2B Rengifo .265/.350/.390, 5 HR, 2 WAR

To quote Funkadelic, "Can we get to that, I wanna know if we can get to that."

Admittedly, I think those projects are very optimistic and probably the absolute best case scenario of what we could expect.

That said, Trout being a 9 fWAR player, Rendon being a 5-7 fWAR player, and Fletcher a 3-4 fWAR player does mean that we can likely "get by" with most of the rest of the supporting players being around 1-2 fWAR.

I think it's likely that some will underperformance the 1-2 fWAR goal, but as long as we can avoid players in the negatives (a la Adell this year, Rengifo, etc), then that should be good enough.

Combine this with a big pitching signing like Bauer, and a suddenly rather good rotation of Bauer, Bundy, Heaney, Canning, and Barria (plus maybe Ohtani to some degree), and this team looks significantly improved.

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I am not assuming Ward could be an everyday player....but it isn't unheard of for a guy to figure it out at 26 or older.  Austin Nola and Mike Yastrzemski didn't get to the bigs until they were 29....it happens, not a lot, but it happens....I'd like to see Ward get all the AB's in RF for the rest of the season.....not giving up on Adell, just think Ward has earned a chance....Adell has time to figure it out...

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10 minutes ago, DMVol said:

I am not assuming Ward could be an everyday player....but it isn't unheard of for a guy to figure it out at 26 or older.  Austin Nola and Mike Yastrzemski didn't get to the bigs until they were 29....it happens, not a lot, but it happens....I'd like to see Ward get all the AB's in RF for the rest of the season.....

It’d be pretty nice if Walsh and Ward wound up being our version of those two. 

Their performance might just be helping Eppler get at least a shot at GM in ‘21 too. If the prospects he’s been holding onto and developing keep showing something this next week or so, it could help prove his vision of relying on the kids and the farm post 2020 is bearing some fruit.

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2 hours ago, DMVol said:

I am not assuming Ward could be an everyday player....but it isn't unheard of for a guy to figure it out at 26 or older.  Austin Nola and Mike Yastrzemski didn't get to the bigs until they were 29....it happens, not a lot, but it happens....I'd like to see Ward get all the AB's in RF for the rest of the season.....not giving up on Adell, just think Ward has earned a chance....Adell has time to figure it out...

And Josh Donaldson 

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3 hours ago, eligrba said:

Ward is a utility player at best. If Barreto can hit, he would immediately move past Ward on the depth charts because of his speed.  Ward is not a solution for anything at this point.  But it is nice he is not an automatic out like some others.

Ward has good athleticism as well.

Has stolen double digits bases in the minors twice (18 in 2018, 11 in 2019).

Edited by Angel Oracle
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54 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

And Josh Donaldson 

I’ve actually thrown a couple Donaldson comps out for Ward out in the past. They had similarities in their production between minors and bigs around the same time in their careers, also around when both started moving away from catching.

Not necessarily believing the same ceiling is there, just a chance that he can still be a solid big leaguer.

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If Adell needs major league at bats, even if he is struggling, to become the player we think he can be, then you give the at bats to Adell.

If they think Adell needs more time in the minors then you use Ward and hope he keeps performing at an acceptable rate as the placeholder.

I still have zero confidence that Ward is now or ever will be even close to being a reliable regular in the majors.

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2 hours ago, Game 6 said:

I think the “small sample size” argument should work both ways, not only when someone is trying defend the poor play of a player they like.

I would let them battle for it in ST. Ward is 5 years older than Adell. It gives him an advantage. 

The difference is I predict Adell will be an impact player and Ward could maybe be someone who doesn’t hurt you.  Maybe.

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