Chuckster70

Jo Adell with a shot to claim starting RF job out of ST?

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1 minute ago, SoPas Angel said:

I tend to agree with you. 43 strikeouts in 121AB in AAA indicates a guy who needs more time there. I was just asking, if he looks great in ST, would do they do?

I think Epp is smarter than to buy into a great performance .vs weak competition.   People get hyped up but there are a lot of things about ST in AZ that leads to inflated numbers.  Anything can happen but he didnt look ready last fall.  If people are being honest, Marsh looked more capable of making the jump than Adell did.  Thankfully we still have both of them.

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13 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

I think Epp is smarter than to buy into a great performance .vs weak competition.   People get hyped up but there are a lot of things about ST in AZ that leads to inflated numbers.  Anything can happen but he didnt look ready last fall.  If people are being honest, Marsh looked more capable of making the jump than Adell did.  Thankfully we still have both of them.

Jo Adell is more of a traditional power hitter than let's say Mike Trout was, so he's going to strikeout more. 

But you could also say by going by Taylor Ward's numbers in AAA the past two years that he's ready for major league pitching since he walks nearly as much as he strikes out and he's hit for power and average there. 

But like Eppler said it's how he looks. If he shows a good approach and is squaring up the ball up in ST to all fields and playing good defense, he may prove that he's ready for his rookie campaign to begin on opening day. 

ST numbers are inflated, but we've also seen players who have hit well in ST carry over that success into the regular season. So nothing is a guarantee either way.

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40 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

Jo Adell is more of a traditional power hitter than let's say Mike Trout was, so he's going to strikeout more. 

But you could also say by going by Taylor Ward's numbers in AAA the past two years that he's ready for major league pitching since he walks nearly as much as he strikes out and he's hit for power and average there. 

But like Eppler said it's how he looks. If he shows a good approach and is squaring up the ball up in ST to all fields and playing good defense, he may prove that he's ready for his rookie campaign to begin on opening day. 

ST numbers are inflated, but we've also seen players who have hit well in ST carry over that successand into the regular season. So nothing is a guarantee either way.

It isn't about any particular stat...  I'm not saying he's not walking enough or K-ing too much (he is).

Striking out and being made to look foolish are different things, he was made to look foolish at times by weak pitchers.... It's an experience thing, he just hasn't seen some stuff yet, doesn't know what to expect.

Adell has been able to use sheer athletic ability to get by at times, it's that rare God given ability that sets him apart from most prospects, but MLB isn't AA.   There are a ton of crafty lefties and seasoned veterans in AAA that don't have anywhere near the ability that Adell does, but can teach him how to get over, how pitchers will try to beat him.  Experience is the best teacher.

Adell will come up, but he's not ready.  AAA and the AFL made it pretty clear.   It's not a lack of talent, it's just the lack of miles.

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45 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

It isn't about any particular stat...  I'm not saying he's not walking enough or K-ing too much (he is).

Striking out and being made to look foolish are different things, he was made to look foolish at times by weak pitchers.... It's an experience thing, he just hasn't seen some stuff yet, doesn't know what to expect.

Adell has been able to use sheer athletic ability to get by at times, it's that rare God given ability that sets him apart from most prospects, but MLB isn't AA.   There are a ton of crafty lefties and seasoned veterans in AAA that don't have anywhere near the ability that Adell does, but can teach him how to get over, how pitchers will try to beat him.  Experience is the best teacher.

Adell will come up, but he's not ready.  AAA and the AFL made it pretty clear.   It's not a lack of talent, it's just the lack of miles.

Sounds all good and I don't disagree, but I hope you're 100% wrong and he gets the starting nod out of ST.

I've seen too many players who were not even expected to report to AAA and get a starting nod out of spring training due to a solid camp. 

For some players it just all of sudden just clicks, or they've received some instructions on their mechanics or approach that completely change the outcome. 

See Max Muncy when the coaching staff had him get lower in his stance. 

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My 2 cents....

The Angels clearly think, as of Feb 12, 2020, that Adell needs some time at AAA. So he’s going to have to do quite a bit to change their minds on that.

Are they open to it? I believe they are because of what they did with Ohtani. He was awful in spring training so no one would have batted an eye if they’d started him in the minors. They didn’t. 
 

Finally, the CBA is going to be different by the time Adell is eligible for free agency. It would sure stink if the Angels keep him down for 15 or 17 days only to have to them change the rules so they needed to keep him down for 30 days. 
 

And you can always just avoid this problem by signing the player to an extension before he gets to free agency.
 

(Trout had been up in 2011, so his late start in 2012 didn’t matter. He already had a bunch of days.)

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I have been burned in the past by over or under valuing spring performances.  

Albert is typically a spring beast.  So was/is Cron.  La Stella was awful last year.  Ohtani was terrible his first spring.  Yates was released.  

I have no idea when and how it translates.  

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5 hours ago, Dochalo said:

I have been burned in the past by over or under valuing spring performances.  

Albert is typically a spring beast.  So was/is Cron.  La Stella was awful last year.  Ohtani was terrible his first spring.  Yates was released.  

I have no idea when and how it translates.  

Daniel Hudson released too.

Brian Goodwin sucked so bad with the Royals on a team in need of OF's and he was released. 

Both last spring.

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This thread has a lot of information.  

Albert if healthy will absolutely start on opening day.  

Adell striking out a third of the time last year in AAA is a pretty good indication that he will start the season in AAA, which is completely fine.  If people want to call that manipulation of service time, go right ahead.  But a third of the time last year he struck out at the highest level he played at.  That is basically what Justin Bour did last year as an Angel or what Taylor Ward did as a rookie.  So while the future is bright for Adell and I believe we all think he will be a monster, its completely fine if he starts being a monster in May or June.  

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1 hour ago, Stradling said:

This thread has a lot of information.  

Albert if healthy will absolutely start on opening day.  

Adell striking out a third of the time last year in AAA is a pretty good indication that he will start the season in AAA, which is completely fine.  If people want to call that manipulation of service time, go right ahead.  But a third of the time last year he struck out at the highest level he played at.  That is basically what Justin Bour did last year as an Angel or what Taylor Ward did as a rookie.  So while the future is bright for Adell and I believe we all think he will be a monster, its completely fine if he starts being a monster in May or June.  

I will just say that If Adell strikes out 30% of the time in the majors, that may or may not be an actual problem in today’s game.  It would entirely depend on how successful he was when he was not striking out.

I count multiple players last year that struck out over 27% of the time and still managed 4+ WAR overall.

Adell doesn’t need to be a 4 WAR player in 2020.   I would be really happy with a 2 WAR season out of him.  That leaves possible space for the high strikeout rate. 
 

The truth is MOST players that strikeout that much are not productive overall.  Just saying it is possible to strikeout that much and still be a positive contributor. 

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I highly doubt Adell is the starting RFer on Opening Day. He is not Trout. He's got some legitimate swing and miss concerns and the Angels will want to see signs of progress in AAA. 

That said, there is a path to him being the Opening Day starting RFer but it involves both of two things happening: Goodwin gets hurt AND Adell has a monster spring, showing marked reduction in Ks.

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