All else being within reason, your choice?

[Pancake Bear]

Thoughts?

[Angels_Fan]

My dream offseason would be Darvish, Gray and Contreras. Not sure if any of this is too feasible, though (they probably won’t give them away without the Angels trading a lot of good prospects, at least).

Kluber, Contreras and Gray sounds nice, too.

[mmc]

Kluber, Ryu, Maldonado, and Betances

[Docwaukee]

Ryu but depends on cost.  Not a fan of Mad Bum.  Both have red flags.  As does Keuchel but we kinda know who he is now whereas with the other two not as much.  Ryu is coming off a season that he'll never repeat and Mad Bum has concerning splits and isn't likely to ever be the guy that we saw in the WS.  And based on cost estimates, he's probably the highest risk.  

I really don't care that much about catcher anymore as long as we get someone from that list or Romine maybe.  Don't want to see Billy lay out prospects for Contreras.  He's overrated big time.  

[Angels_Make_Me_Drink]

Kluber, Keuchel, Castro

[ScottT]

Ryu and Maldonado

I think they might get more, though 

Arte is all in, you twats.

[Pancake Bear]

40 minutes ago, ScottT said:

Ryu and Maldonado

I think they might get more, though 

Arte is all in, you twats.

That'd be my picks plus a trade for another pitcher. Who that will be is gonna depend on the cost, which I have no way of knowing. 

[ScottT]

Well, yeah, I want more.  Damn radio buttons 

[Chuck]

Kluber or Gray and Bumgarner or Ryu + Castro AND Maldonado.

[tchula]

I want to trade for Kluber.  I know the injury history, but the upside could be huge.  I would even be willing to trade some prospect capital, but we could also get some prospect capital in return.  If we make a package like Rengifo, Suarez, Barria, Jones,  Yan, and Adams for Kluber, Bo Naylor,  Ethan Hankins, and Scott Moss or something to that effect.  

[Dtwncbad]

I am already so sick of hearing the nickname MadBum that I hope he doesn’t end up here.  The only thing more grating would be if Scioscia was still here and he was constantly saying MadBumsy.

[totdprods]

Against better judgement I think I’ll go with the upside, even if it comes with durability questions, and choose Ryu and Kluber as my top two. If those two do pitch to their ceilings, this becomes a WS-caliber team. Kluber shouldn’t cost too much in trade and the money/years are relatively light. Ryu will have a high AAV but hopefully a fairly short-term deal. 

I would love Keuchel, and this applies to Ryu too, but one of these teams (MIN, LAD, HOU, CIN) that missed out is going to offer something crazy, especially with guys like Roark getting $12m AAV. I don’t really want to pay Keuchel ~$20m AAV and I wouldn’t rule it out anymore. 

I do like Gray and Boyd as options for the second arm too, given their relatively low salaries and control. Gives the Halos a lot more flexibility in future years and still offers significant upside.

Any of Castro, Maldonado, or Romine for catcher. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by totdprods

[Mark68]

I said Ryu & Castro. Both would be upgrades and can fit within the budget. I’m certainly open to trading for a starting pitcher, especially Darvish or Gray (on top of the above signings).

[totdprods]

The FA market is a little stressful. Let’s assume the Angels have roughly $50-60m left for SP. That might be a bit of a stretch, but it’s realistic.

The $30m arms 

How much will Ryu get now? $30m? Since he’ll likely have a couple fewer years, a team could really pump up the AAV there which makes the Angels unlikely given the other needs. 

Price is also at $30m+ AAV unless Boston eats money, and if they eat money, we start having to chip in at least decent prospects. That makes him unlikelier. If we take his full salary though, maybe we get Benintendi or Chavis, and we don’t pay good prospects, and we could use that pool in a deal for someone relatively cheap either salary-wise, like someone like Boyd or Gray who are around $5m, or in years, like Quintana, Ray, Stroman, all around $11-13m.

The $20m+ arms 

Bumgarner’s relative youth and durability may net him more years and therefore, a lesser AAV/annual salary, and while his upside is limited and there are red flags, if he lands around 5/$110m that’s only a $22m AAV which isn’t terrible and is probably a salary that fits better for the Angels than Ryu or Price.

Kluber and Darvish are both around $20m AAV which would be a ‘sweet spot’ I would think. It should allow the Angels to still add one more SP and a catcher much more easily. 

The $15-$20m arms

The other FA SPs are making me nervous. If Roark is getting $12m AAV, Porcello $10m AAV, Lyles $8m AAV...then Keuchel is probably gonna get something closer to $20m than $15m, and depending on the years, that might be way too much to commit. Teheran probably costs comparably here too. This feels like the riskiest group to shop in, in many ways, with the greatest chance of a contract busting or a pitcher resulting in production we probably could have gotten cheaper internally or elsewhere.

Less than (or around) $10m trade arms

These guys are probably only realistic if we acquire expensive FAs (no prospects, less payroll flexibility) but will cost significant prospect capital. They’re numerous, Jon Gray, Matt Boyd, Caleb Smith, but also come with long-term control. There are FA options too but it’s likely guys such as Homer Bailey and Drew Smyly and we definitely are not at that point of desperation yet. 

And then there are the one-year pending FA types. Eppler would probably have to ‘overpay’ because frankly, they’re rentals and almost any prospect dealt away will be an overpay, but Robbie Ray, Jose Quintana, Marcus Stroman, maybe even James Paxton now? all come around a $10-$13m salary which fits in nicely with a $20-$30 arm listed above - which also works well given those arms might not cost much in prospects, while these will cost something. 

So, looking at this from a higher level, it would make sense for the Angels, I think, to try and acquire one of the $20-30m arms as they won’t cost much in prospect capital - and then dish out prospects for one of the ~$10m or less rental/long-term crowd. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by totdprods

[Stradling]

Just a hunch, but I am guessing they have about half that to spend on pitching.  We are about $180 million right now after the Rendon signing.  Now it is totally possible that Arte doesn't see the tax as an issue this year, but until we see it we shouldn't expect it.  

[hangin n wangin]

My choice for catcher is Robinson Chirinos. My choice for free agent pitcher would be Ryu on a short deal.

And if we make a trade for a pitcher, I would like either Kluber or Jon Gray.

[GrittyVeterans]

Kluber and Kuechel.

Castro or Maldonado

 

weve come this far, don’t be cheap now

[gotbeer]

21 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Just a hunch, but I am guessing they have about half that to spend on pitching.  We are about $180 million right now after the Rendon signing.  Now it is totally possible that Arte doesn't see the tax as an issue this year, but until we see it we shouldn't expect it.  

According to Cot's.  We are still $34.7 million under the cap.  It's getting tight.  But still doable.

[Stradling]

I guess depending on acquisition cost my choice for pitching would probably be either Darvish or Gray.  I don't know much about Gray but his numbers look good.  He's also 28 which means there might be more there.  

[VariousCrap]

After Eppler did all that work to build the farm system, I am hesitate to trade for SP.

At this point, I'd be happy with the Angels signing Keuchel and Teheran.

Keuchel, Ohtani, Canning, Teheran, Bundy, Heaney is a strong rotation and a million times better than what the Angels had last year.

[AngelStew43]

Does anyone know whether or not we would go over the cap if we acquired both Darvish and Contreras?  Cubs are rumored to want to drop payroll.  We have, what, about 35-45 mil left after Rendon?  

I am thinking that at least one of Rengifo, Fletcher, or LaStella may be on the move, as we only have 2B and utility infielder spots up for grabs.

[totdprods]

@Stradling and @gotbeer - yeah, $50m-$60m is in my mind, an absolute max. $30ish probably more realistic. 

That said, they could maybe go far above for one or two years, which isn’t impossible I would think. 

I think I would choose one of the ~$20-$30m (Ryu, Bumgarner, Price) arms since it won’t come at a prospect cost, and a trade for one of the ~$10m or less arm (Gray, Ray, Stroman, Boyd, Quintana), rather than two of the ~$20-$30m arms, or one of those and a ~$15-20m arms, or two of the $15-$20m arms (Keuchel, Teheran) with Kluber and Darvish being the lone ~$20m exceptions based on their trade cost.

Edited December 12, 2019 by totdprods

[gotbeer]

37 minutes ago, AngelStew43 said:

Does anyone know whether or not we would go over the cap if we acquired both Darvish and Contreras?  Cubs are rumored to want to drop payroll.  We have, what, about 35-45 mil left after Rendon?  

I am thinking that at least one of Rengifo, Fletcher, or LaStella may be on the move, as we only have 2B and utility infielder spots up for grabs.

Darvish 4 years/$81 million cap hit $21 million

Contreras Arbitration 1.  Estimated $4.75 million.  

But that Contreras being in Arb 1 should tell you how much, if they are even willing to listen to offers, it would cost in trade.

[Angel Oracle]

Ryu, along with an innings eater with a sub 4.50 ERA and either Castro or Machete 

Maybe Keuchel would do solid enough work here.   He does have the durability that is desperately needed in this rotation, and generally averages 6-6.5 innings/start.   And, he is only 32 in 2020.

DO NOT trade Adell, Marsh, or Adams.

Edited December 12, 2019 by Angel Oracle

[UndertheHalo]

Also this talk about trading Canning is nuts.