Plan B: What do you think the best option for the Angels is now?

[ten ocho recon scout]

I get creative when i take my adult underwear off, nahm' sayin!

[CarniifeX]

I have a feeling we’ll end up with a pitcher nobody has talked about that much. I’m thinking Syndergaard. 

[Angels_Fan]

1 minute ago, CarniifeX said:

I have a feeling we’ll end up with a pitcher nobody has talked about that much. I’m thinking Syndergaard. 

At what cost, though? Cole cost only $$$. Syndergaard would deplete the farm system. 

[CarniifeX]

Just now, Angels_Fan said:

At what cost, though? Cole cost only $$$. Syndergaard would deplete the farm system. 

He won’t “deplete the farm system”. I’m definitely willing to throw Marsh in a deal — obviously not Adell, though.

Marsh, Fletch, and a few b-level prospects might get it done?

[Tank]

15 minutes ago, Sean-Regan said:

Why would the Reds trade Bauer? They’re competing. 

Kluber, maybe, but he’s a rental. Keuchel, great. We can match up Ohtani, Keuchel, and Heaney against Cole, Severino, and Tanaka. 

The question was what’s your plan B. Everyone has a price and no one is untradeable. If you’re pissed at the Halos, no need to take it out on me.

[eligrba4ever]

Plan B??? Two of whoever is left who can pitch effectively for 200 innings.

[Pancake Bear]

1 minute ago, Tank said:

The question was what’s your plan B. Everyone has a price and no one is untradeable. If you’re pissed at the Halos, no need to take it out on me.

You said trade for a guy who won’t be available. Why are you ripping me for poitnting out that your plan won’t work?

[Angels_Fan]

9 minutes ago, CarniifeX said:

He won’t “deplete the farm system”. I’m definitely willing to throw Marsh in a deal — obviously not Adell, though.

Marsh, Fletch, and a few b-level prospects might get it done?

They're not giving away Syndergaard for just that. Besides, that would create another hole (who replaces Fletcher?).

Eppler should sign Rendon, sign a starter like Ryu, maybe look to acquire Price at a reduced salary, and upgrade at catcher. It wasn't the dream scenario, but it would at least give the Angels a decent chance at the postseason. There aren't many good options remaining, unless the Angels want to deplete their farm system.

[TroutField]

7 minutes ago, CarniifeX said:

He won’t “deplete the farm system”. I’m definitely willing to throw Marsh in a deal — obviously not Adell, though.

Marsh, Fletch, and a few b-level prospects might get it done?

Stupidity 

[eligrba4ever]

Plan B?? It is more important if Ohtani can start injury-free and be effective for 34 starts and 200-plus innings on 4 days' rest, than logging an above-average 400 PAs.

[AngelsLakersFan]

I suppose they have to go hard after Rendon now. They can use the surplus in the infield to make a trade package centered around Fletcher and say Adams for the best pitcher we can get. Then they sign the cheapest of whichever FA starter is available, while also grabbing their favorite mediocre catcher. 

[Vlad27Trout27]

This should be our plan B C D E F...... 

1A. Eppler gets on the phone with the Cubs and trades for Darvish and Happ, absorbing most of Darvish's salary 

Angels get: Darvish of the 81 mil he's owned for the next 4 years, we are on the hook for 65 mil. Than we get a solid Player that has not been given the time to show his skills and he's our Rf.

Cubs: get Salary relief, and are on the hook for about 16 mil for the next four years.

So Darvish's Salary over the next 4 years: 18, 18, 15 and 14

!B. Similar case to 1A but we also take on Chatwoods full salary but for Contreras and maybe Happ 

3.  Trade with Padres

Angels get Myers and 50 mil of his 3 contract, Plus we get 2 top 10 prospects.  aka Patino and Weather/Morejon

Pads are on the hook for 10 mil for the next 3 years.

3 Price

Angels get Price and 66 mil of his remaining contract for the next 3 years + Benintendi and maybe Groome

Boston: Salary relief, and a better chance to go after Betts.

Also i find it hard for Boston to be able to trade Price without adding a Significant piece in return.  (Pads don't mess this up)

 

I think also of these are helpful scenario for us and both Pads and the Sox are know to be trying to get out if these contracts. i think we can take 1 or 2 of these contracts and find value in them.

For example, i don't think we can get Contreras, in a salary dumb. But 1A and maybe 3 can be done.

So we get Darvish, Happ, Price and Benintendi. 

With the way i constructed my salary relief  we are looking at about 46 mils added to the payroll.Leaving us with addition 20+. But we  also added some good pieces to the rotation and line-up

1. Darvish 2. Ohtani 3. Price 4. Caning 5. Heaney 6. Bundy

and if we want we can add Benintendi to the trade market and get a pitcher in return, Kluber /Clevinger maybe Bauer/ Thor 

Or we can go with option 1 and 2, Plus get Ryu and two prospects from the Pads,.

 

 

 

[jchalos89]

smfh honestly, I don't think any option out there will make the Angels contender.

Seriously Ryu? he had 1 great year right before his contract yr after spending 60% of his time in Majors in DL.

MadBum is posting 5+ ERA outside of Oracle and is way over 30 YO and he is officially demanding 9 figure contract, which makes 0 sense.

All of our current starters either suck, or are injury prones. 

Maybe just tank until this team can get rid of Puljos and try again

[Angels_Fan]

Just now, jchalos89 said:

smfh honestly, I don't think any option out there will make the Angels contender.

Seriously Ryu? he had 1 great year right before his contract yr after spending 60% of his time in Majors in DL.

MadBum is posting 5+ ERA outside of Oracle and is way over 30 YO and he is officially demanding 9 figure contract, which makes 0 sense.

All of our current starters either suck, or are injury prones. 

Maybe just tank until this team can get rid of Puljos and try again

None of those options are ideal. But that's why Eppler needs to sign Rendon (who will provide 5-6 WAR) and sign or acquire via trade another two starters plus upgrade at catcher.

Maybe Ohtani can be that ace we need, even with only 25 starts per year...

[Glen]

Trevor Bauer has had one really good season and thinks he is much better than he is.  Do not trade for him.

[Pancake Bear]

What realistically is the path forward right now?

The Angels have a lot of questions on offense. Can La Stella repeat? Can Upton and Simmons rebound? Will Pujols play every day if healthy? Will Adell even be ready this year? Will any of the young players like Thaiss or Rengifo become solid enough major leaguers any time soon?

Pitching is even worse. How will Ohtani do this season coming off TJS? Can Heaney ever actually stay healthy? Will Canning be able to take the next step? Any of the other guys? Is Bundy just a meh pitcher or will getting out of the AL East and having Callaway as a coach help him take it to the next level?

The options for improving the team are old and will cost a lot of either money or prospects. If we spend prospects, we're putting a huge risk into being able to compete the next few years. You have to have young, cheap talent - that's what we haven't had the last five years. 

But if we invest big in guys like Rendon and Ryu (or worse, Bumgarner or Keuchel) - the pitchers named are the kind of guys who fall apart at this age, which puts our payroll flexibility in huge trouble.

We can probably improve the team in 2020 by getting some of these guys. Here's the problem: Short-term, none of them will be enough. Rendon doesn't make our offense top of the league by himself, especially if any of our question marks become problems (Simmons or Upton don't bounce back, La Stella sucks, Adell doesn't figure it out).

While we can probably improve enough to make the Wild Card, what then? We aren't nearly good enough to beat the Yankees. 

Spending 200+m on Rendon only makes sense for the next 2-3 years. Who is going to pitch those years? We'd be betting big on our guys in the minors working out or risking everything by trading them for impact guys. 

With Cole, we would've had that frontline guy to build around. It would've given us a shot. Without him? I don't know how we can match up against teams like NY or LA in the next few years, regardless of what moves we make. 

But if we sell, Trout's chance at a championship with us is over. 

I wish someone could show me a feasible path that actually accounts for how to make the team good enough in the next 2 years without pulling a Dipoto, because I just can't see it.

[jchalos89]

1 minute ago, Angels_Fan said:

None of those options are ideal. But that's why Eppler needs to sign Rendon (who will provide 5-6 WAR) and sign or acquire via trade another two starters plus upgrade at catcher.

Maybe Ohtani can be that ace we need, even with only 25 starts per year...

Yes now Rendon is a must. If they can't get him, they better not give old, injury plagued starting pitchers 3+ year contracts and just tank.

I'm not down with that maybe Ohtani can be the ace scenario. If he does, that's good. But I don't think we can assume he will be, especially when he is coming back from TJS and had whole year off from pitching.

2015-2019, Angel fans have been saying "maybe we are good if guys are healthy next year", "maybe we are good if pujols bounces back", "maybe we good something something" and every single year this team has been sending entire pitching crew to DL and this team has been getting like 0-1 guy who pitches over 160 innings (and even those guys sucked like Nolasco) + pujols is never bouncing back.

 

[jchalos89]

7 minutes ago, Sean-Regan said:

What realistically is the path forward right now?

The Angels have a lot of questions on offense. Can La Stella repeat? Can Upton and Simmons rebound? Will Pujols play every day if healthy? Will Adell even be ready this year? Will any of the young players like Thaiss or Rengifo become solid enough major leaguers any time soon?

Pitching is even worse. How will Ohtani do this season coming off TJS? Can Heaney ever actually stay healthy? Will Canning be able to take the next step? Any of the other guys? Is Bundy just a meh pitcher or will getting out of the AL East and having Callaway as a coach help him take it to the next level?

The options for improving the team are old and will cost a lot of either money or prospects. If we spend prospects, we're putting a huge risk into being able to compete the next few years. You have to have young, cheap talent - that's what we haven't had the last five years. 

But if we invest big in guys like Rendon and Ryu (or worse, Bumgarner or Keuchel) - the pitchers named are the kind of guys who fall apart at this age, which puts our payroll flexibility in huge trouble.

We can probably improve the team in 2020 by getting some of these guys. Here's the problem: Short-term, none of them will be enough. Rendon doesn't make our offense top of the league by himself, especially if any of our question marks become problems (Simmons or Upton don't bounce back, La Stella sucks, Adell doesn't figure it out).

While we can probably improve enough to make the Wild Card, what then? We aren't nearly good enough to beat the Yankees. 

Spending 200+m on Rendon only makes sense for the next 2-3 years. Who is going to pitch those years? We'd be betting big on our guys in the minors working out or risking everything by trading them for impact guys. 

With Cole, we would've had that frontline guy to build around. It would've given us a shot. Without him? I don't know how we can match up against teams like NY or LA in the next few years, regardless of what moves we make. 

But if we sell, Trout's chance at a championship with us is over. 

I wish someone could show me a feasible path that actually accounts for how to make the team good enough in the next 2 years without pulling a Dipoto, because I just can't see it.

100% agreed, and sadly and frankly, I think a lot of answers to your questions are most likely to be "no". That's what makes it worse.

[AngelsLakersFan]

8 minutes ago, Sean-Regan said:

What realistically is the path forward right now?

The Angels have a lot of questions on offense. Can La Stella repeat? Can Upton and Simmons rebound? Will Pujols play every day if healthy? Will Adell even be ready this year? Will any of the young players like Thaiss or Rengifo become solid enough major leaguers any time soon?

Pitching is even worse. How will Ohtani do this season coming off TJS? Can Heaney ever actually stay healthy? Will Canning be able to take the next step? Any of the other guys? Is Bundy just a meh pitcher or will getting out of the AL East and having Callaway as a coach help him take it to the next level?

The options for improving the team are old and will cost a lot of either money or prospects. If we spend prospects, we're putting a huge risk into being able to compete the next few years. You have to have young, cheap talent - that's what we haven't had the last five years. 

But if we invest big in guys like Rendon and Ryu (or worse, Bumgarner or Keuchel) - the pitchers named are the kind of guys who fall apart at this age, which puts our payroll flexibility in huge trouble.

We can probably improve the team in 2020 by getting some of these guys. Here's the problem: Short-term, none of them will be enough. Rendon doesn't make our offense top of the league by himself, especially if any of our question marks become problems (Simmons or Upton don't bounce back, La Stella sucks, Adell doesn't figure it out).

While we can probably improve enough to make the Wild Card, what then? We aren't nearly good enough to beat the Yankees. 

Spending 200+m on Rendon only makes sense for the next 2-3 years. Who is going to pitch those years? We'd be betting big on our guys in the minors working out or risking everything by trading them for impact guys. 

With Cole, we would've had that frontline guy to build around. It would've given us a shot. Without him? I don't know how we can match up against teams like NY or LA in the next few years, regardless of what moves we make. 

But if we sell, Trout's chance at a championship with us is over. 

I wish someone could show me a feasible path that actually accounts for how to make the team good enough in the next 2 years without pulling a Dipoto, because I just can't see it.

Sadly you are right. The feasible path is simply the one where a lot of things break our way.

[Troll Daddy]

expect a Big Trade

[Docwaukee]

plan B, C, D etc. has sailed for me.  

I can tell you what I don't want.  To trade away a mess of the farm for players that are controlled for 1-2 years only.  

[ten ocho recon scout]

2 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

expect a Big Trade

In all honesty, i believe this. Eppler had already made mention that theyve been in talks, fwiw.

I think they knew they lost out on cole yesterday. Boras did his mystery team thing, and probably tried to lure us into trying to counter NY over the last 24 hours, and we knew we were out.

Wasnt it yesterday that we started getting linked to everyone else? I think we made a huge offer sunday night, and yanks pulled their dick out.

[Angels_Fan]

2 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

Sadly you are right. The feasible path is simply the one where a lot of things break our way.

If Eppler signs Rendon, acquires someone like Price (at a much reduced salary) or Darvish via trade, signs Ryu, and gets a catcher, the Angels would still be in the postseason hunt, no? All Arte has to do is open his checkbook.

Yea, the Angels would need to hope that these starters actually stay healthy. But that's what happens for missing out on Cole.

[UndertheHalo]

I think Rendon does actually move us into the upper echelon of offenses in baseball.  He’s pretty great.  Obviously there’s still more work to be done.  But at least with Rendon we can pretend. 

I think getting David Price is an absolute disaster and there is no non pie in the sky argument for getting him.  And, letting the Red Sox be rid of that deal makes them. - a powerhouse direct competitor - better.  It’s a brutal, awful idea.  

Edited December 11, 2019 by UndertheHalo

[AngelsLakersFan]

2 minutes ago, Angels_Fan said:

If Eppler signs Rendon, acquires someone like Price (at a much reduced salary) or Darvish via trade, signs Ryu, and gets a catcher, the Angels would still be in the postseason hunt, no? All Arte has to do is open his checkbook.

Yea, the Angels would need to hope that these starters actually stay healthy. But that's what happens for missing out on Cole.

Then you are looking at an increase in payroll significantly higher than what we were willing to do for Cole.