Chuckster70

MLB Network: Joel Sherman plays Angels GM for day

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Any Contract is movable if you take on money.

Exactly my point all week regarding Cozart. I don't want Craig Kimbrell really, but if it was in exchange for Zack Cozart and a lower tier prospect, who wouldn't take that gamble?

And Upton for Price is actually intriguing. I'd prefer Sale obviously, over Price, but either works. Price actually has such a negative surplus value, that it probably costs them Benintendi to move him for Upton, and the Angels have to throw them a guy like say Knowles or Jones or something off the top ten list, but not an elite guy like Adell or Marsh.

Can you imagine a scenario where they get Price, Cole, and a guy like Wheeler or Bumgarner? Plus Kimbrel, and Grandal? And yes it's doable financially.

Trading Upton for Price and Benintendi adds like $15 in luxury tax dollars per season, but the real dollars are similar. Upton makes 72/3 and Price is at $93/3. Bientiendi is under arbitration.

Assume Cole comes at $34 AAV, but lower in years one and two in real dollars. Assume Wheeler/Bumgarner comes at 21 AAV and is lower in years one and two in real dollars. Grandal is gonna be around 3/51.

Kimbrel costing only Cozart and a prospect is only gonna cost $3-4 M. I'd send them Bedrosian in exchange. So that the deal is salary neutral.

You have $140ish committed. Add the $15 for the Price/ Bientiendi deal, add $22 for Cole in his first year, add $14 for Wheeler in his first year, $14 for Grandal in his first. That brings the real payroll up to 206. Which is an increase of about 20M. You could ask for $5M in the Kimbrel deal and $3M in the Price deal per year, and probably get it.

Then you'd be at $198.

With a lineup of

Fletcher INF

Trout CF

Ohtani DH

Adell RF / Goodwin RF

Grandal C

Simmons SS

Pujols 1B

La Stella INF

Benintendi LF / Marsh LF

 

And a rotation of

Cole, Wheeler, Price, Ohtani, Heaney, Canning

 

With a pen of

Kimbrel, Robles, Buttrey, Middelton, Anderson, Ramirez, Pena, Cole

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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33 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Is Vlad a black dude too?

Well, I’m pretty sure both their African Dominican ancestors arrived on ships just like the African American “black dudes” he was referencing did. 

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20 minutes ago, SoPas Angel said:

Upton was crap last season but put up 3.8 bWAR in '18 and 5.8 bWAR in '17. I have more faith in him bouncing back than I do Price. 

Price bWar last 3 years

2017 1.6 

2018 4.4

2019 1.9

Total of 7.9

Upton bWar last 3 years

2017 5.8

2018 3.8

2019 -0.9

Total of 8.7

It's close but Upton was more valuable. Sherman did mention that the Angels need to take a gamble and that's what this trade would be. Upton will be 33 in August and Price will be 35 in August. 

I don't love or hate this idea but I agree that the Angels would need to get someone else back in the deal. By trading away Upton, Adell would have to start the year in right field and left field would be Goodwin unless a left fielder comes back from Boston.

Bottom line is, this is just a small segment from a television program and no real life inside info. 

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2 minutes ago, beatlesrule said:

Price bWar last 3 years

2017 1.6 

2018 4.4

2019 1.9

Total of 7.9

Upton bWar last 3 years

2017 5.8

2018 3.8

2019 -0.9

Total of 8.7

It's close but Upton was more valuable. Sherman did mention that the Angels need to take a gamble and that's what this trade would be. Upton will be 33 in August and Price will be 35 in August. 

I don't love or hate this idea but I agree that the Angels would need to get someone else back in the deal. By trading away Upton, Adell would have to start the year in right field and left field would be Goodwin unless a left fielder comes back from Boston.

Bottom line is, this is just a small segment from a television program and no real life inside info. 

 

1 minute ago, beatlesrule said:

Price bWar last 3 years

2017 1.6 

2018 4.4

2019 1.9

Total of 7.9

Upton bWar last 3 years

2017 5.8

2018 3.8

2019 -0.9

Total of 8.7

It's close but Upton was more valuable. Sherman did mention that the Angels need to take a gamble and that's what this trade would be. Upton will be 33 in August and Price will be 35 in August. 

I don't love or hate this idea but I agree that the Angels would need to get someone else back in the deal. By trading away Upton, Adell would have to start the year in right field and left field would be Goodwin unless a left fielder comes back from Boston.

Bottom line is, this is just a small segment from a television program and no real life inside info. 

 

1 minute ago, beatlesrule said:

Price bWar last 3 years

2017 1.6 

2018 4.4

2019 1.9

Total of 7.9

Upton bWar last 3 years

2017 5.8

2018 3.8

2019 -0.9

Total of 8.7

It's close but Upton was more valuable. Sherman did mention that the Angels need to take a gamble and that's what this trade would be. Upton will be 33 in August and Price will be 35 in August. 

I don't love or hate this idea but I agree that the Angels would need to get someone else back in the deal. By trading away Upton, Adell would have to start the year in right field and left field would be Goodwin unless a left fielder comes back from Boston.

Bottom line is, this is just a small segment from a television program and no real life inside info. 

I'm unclear what point you're trying to make.  Could you please post more to clear it up?  Thank you.

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What if the Angels took Jackie Bradley and Price for Upton and Cozart, and Boston ate a bit of salary still?

Off top of head, haven’t looked at salaries or anything. Maybe by taking more Price salary after ‘20 and taking JBJ now, they’d match up better?

Edited by totdprods

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So if im getting this right, he prposed this:
I guess Joel Sherman was on MLB Network today and said this about the Angels:
#1. Sign Gerrit Cole
#2.  Trade Upton & 2 prospects to Boston for David Price
#3.  Sign Yasmani Grandal
#4.  Acquire Craig Kimbrel from Cubs for prospects
If this isnt correct someone please update it but this is what i to from another thread but i didnt hear it first hand

So...  with that, #s 1 and 3 make perfect sense. Although we would still need another pitcher IMO which is why i assume he suggested #2.
#2.  Straight up, maybe, i could see some merit to it but not with added prospects, if anything THEY should add for the salary relief that solves a lot of their problems.  2 guys missing a lot of time one costing 24M more than the other over three years doesnt equate to us adding anything to that deal.  If we added anything AND took on more money thats full win for them.  Plus, where does that leave us for a LF in '20?  Where would they even play him, what did he say about that?    If they are showing Bradley the door send him here then maybe some prospects make sense, but i just dont see it making sense, its creative just screams more what he wants for Boston than what makes sense for us. 
#4.  No, just no, i dont see him spending that kind of money on the pen, they would have to be fringe prospects to take that on or they would need the throw in Contreras ro something to get more, in short, nope. 

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are we that desperate to take on Price for his age 34-36 seasons at a ridiculous salary?  Even if the Sox paid some of that salary, what does it come down to?  20mil per?  Just spend that money on Wheeler.  We're taking away some of our financial flexibility for a marginally useful pitcher.  Forget the name for a second and look at what you're getting for a guy in his mid 30's making tons of money.  The whole point of paying a guy like price that much is so that you get his age 30-33yo season with the assumption that age 34 and beyond is likely gonna be painful.   If here were a free agent this year, he'd be in the Hamels/Keuchel/Ryu range at best getting 2/30-3/45 at most.  

He's on a bullet train to sucktown on the Sox dime and we want to jump in front to take him there ourselves?  

 

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3 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

are we that desperate to take on Price for his age 34-36 seasons at a ridiculous salary?  Even if the Sox paid some of that salary, what does it come down to?  20mil per?  Just spend that money on Wheeler.  We're taking away some of our financial flexibility for a marginally useful pitcher.  Forget the name for a second and look at what you're getting for a guy in his mid 30's making tons of money.  The whole point of paying a guy like price that much is so that you get his age 30-33yo season with the assumption that age 34 and beyond is likely gonna be painful.   If here were a free agent this year, he'd be in the Hamels/Keuchel/Ryu range at best getting 2/30-3/45 at most.  

He's on a bullet train to sucktown on the Sox dime and we want to jump in front to take him there ourselves?  

 

Something something Maddon reunion something something.

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16 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

are we that desperate to take on Price for his age 34-36 seasons at a ridiculous salary?  Even if the Sox paid some of that salary, what does it come down to?  20mil per?  Just spend that money on Wheeler.  We're taking away some of our financial flexibility for a marginally useful pitcher.  Forget the name for a second and look at what you're getting for a guy in his mid 30's making tons of money.  The whole point of paying a guy like price that much is so that you get his age 30-33yo season with the assumption that age 34 and beyond is likely gonna be painful.   If here were a free agent this year, he'd be in the Hamels/Keuchel/Ryu range at best getting 2/30-3/45 at most.  

He's on a bullet train to sucktown on the Sox dime and we want to jump in front to take him there ourselves?  

 

Exactly. Only way this makes sense is if we think getting him out of Boston and the AL East will turn back the clock and make him SuperPrice. Otherwise, we’re creating a hole and spending the same money we would be for another good arm with more upside. 

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7 hours ago, CanadianHalo said:

A 34 year old pitcher who has missed significant time the last 2 seasons due to injuries... gee what could possibly go wrong

I'm glad he's not the GM, because his way we don't get Cole or Wheeler and lose a LF. I would trade Cozart for Kimbrel in a second only because Cozart is an anchor at this point.

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8 minutes ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

I'm glad he's not the GM, because his way we don't get Cole or Wheeler and lose a LF. I would trade Cozart for Kimbrel in a second only because Cozart is an anchor at this point.

It was a rather bizarre proposal, to say the least. 

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34 minutes ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

I'm glad he's not the GM, because his way we don't get Cole or Wheeler and lose a LF. I would trade Cozart for Kimbrel in a second only because Cozart is an anchor at this point.

Cozart is not really tradeable at this point. He’s had season ending shoulder surgery two years in a row and there’s serious questions about his health next year. 

People need to stop thinking that he’s a trading chip.

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2 minutes ago, Tank said:

Cozart is not really tradeable at this point. He’s had season ending shoulder surgery two years in a row and there’s serious questions about his health next year. 

People need to stop thinking that he’s a trading chip.

Yep. He has zero trade value except as a part of a trade including expiring contracts. I feel bad for him but we may not see him play this year.

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These GM for a day ideas are really fun, and I respect that Sherman didn't simply say, "Sign Gerrit Cole." That's the last argument.

Again, I know I'm in the minority here, but I still think the Angels could use a total overhaul of their rotation. The only two I'd want there are Canning and Ohtani and neither were pitching at the end of the year. I'd trade Heaney for a catcher, and bring in Wheeler, Ryu and Hamels and Pineda. Granted that would only be possible by back-loading Wheeler's deal, but it would essentially wipe the pitching slate clean so that they could start the process over.

It just feels like the Heaney is that last holdover left from the Dipoto built pitching staff that we'd all like to forget.

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3 minutes ago, Second Base said:

These GM for a day ideas are really fun, and I respect that Sherman didn't simply say, "Sign Gerrit Cole." That's the last argument.

Again, I know I'm in the minority here, but I still think the Angels could use a total overhaul of their rotation. The only two I'd want there are Canning and Ohtani and neither were pitching at the end of the year. I'd trade Heaney for a catcher, and bring in Wheeler, Ryu and Hamels and Pineda. Granted that would only be possible by back-loading Wheeler's deal, but it would essentially wipe the pitching slate clean so that they could start the process over.

It just feels like the Heaney is that last holdover left from the Dipoto built pitching staff that we'd all like to forget.

Cole, Ohtani, Wheeler, Canning, Gibson

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