THE Official 2019-2020 Hot Stove Thread

[Angel Oracle]

5 hours ago, Stradling said:

The more I look at stats the more I want us to take a chance on a guy like Alex Wood.  If he is healthy which is a big risk, he is better than most of the free agents going into the off season.  His ERA+ is better than Keuchel, Wheeler and Gibson for their careers.  Dude just isn’t healthy.  Last year was a rough year, but I believe he is going into his age 29 season so no reason to think he is done.  I don’t know if his injuries are shoulder or elbow related or something different.  I think we look to add a guy like him in addition to a trade for a Price type of pitcher.  

Wood does have four seasons of 150+ innings in the past six, which is a workhorse compared to the guys in the previous few rotations.

His 2017-18 collective stats in 300+ innings are very solid.

[DMVol]

1 hour ago, VariousCrap said:

Gubicza is still saying on Twitter that the Angels will get a front end of the rotation pitcher this off-season.

I bet his definition of front line may differ from yours and mine....

[Second Base]

54 minutes ago, Stradling said:

And their payroll was virtually nothing coming into the off season.  

@Chuckster70 The low payroll, upside talent and deep farm system are all byproducts of tanking. They've had a playoff caliber team just once in the last ten years and before this winter the largest contact they had ever have it was 6/68 to Jose Abreu, despite playing in one of the larger markets in the country.

Many fans get so sick of tanking because half of baseball isn't even trying to make the playoffs, yet when teams tank, the end result is a club like the Hoston Astros and Chicago Cubs. And the next generation of that will be the White Sox and the Padres. And the A's seem to be in a pretty consistent tanking cycle. Typically somewhere around 4 years on and 4 years off, give or take a year. But when you're small market like they are that's the best they can hope for.

 

[ten ocho recon scout]

3 hours ago, beatlesrule said:

He would have taken MadBum, Dallas and Donaldson over Rendon. Kill, persecute the heretic!!

Seriously though, the Angels would have had to offer Madbum more than the 85 million he got from Arizona. Probably 100 million. No idea about Dallas though and Josh hasn't signed yet. I do like how he stated he doesn't think the Angels are done and that guys like Canning need to be better.  He did mention some trade chips the Angels have that other teams would want. Top 5 lineup is a stretch though IMO. Talked about Ohtani and how Maddon will manage him. Did talk about a possible trade with the Cubs for Contreras. Gave them a B+ offseason so far.

Its a fair take to say the angels would have been better off doing that. Solve multiple problems, etc.

What i think it misses is that rendon is in his prime. And every angel fan is acutely aware of how scarce available star 3Bs are.

Adding to that. I wanted Dallas K. Still let down we didnt get him. But Bumgarner I didnt. Always liked him, and he would have been a boost. But hes on the back end of his career....his prime is behind him.

Wouldnt be horrible (maybe it ends that way), but youre not getting the WS hero the brand name carries.

And Donaldson....yes, great year last year. But how much longer does that last? 

So, I too would have preferred signing multiple guys instead of one.( although for Cole i would have been happy). But the 3 guys listed in that take.... I dont see that combo being the better 200 mill spent than rendon. (And I say that not being nearly as pumped about rendon as most of the board).

[mmc]

 

[hangin n wangin]

14 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Its a fair take to say the angels would have been better off doing that. Solve multiple problems, etc.

What i think it misses is that rendon is in his prime. And every angel fan is acutely aware of how scarce available star 3Bs are.

Adding to that. I wanted Dallas K. Still let down we didnt get him. But Bumgarner I didnt. Always liked him, and he would have been a boost. But hes on the back end of his career....his prime is behind him.

Wouldnt be horrible (maybe it ends that way), but youre not getting the WS hero the brand name carries.

And Donaldson....yes, great year last year. But how much longer does that last? 

So, I too would have preferred signing multiple guys instead of one.( although for Cole i would have been happy). But the 3 guys listed in that take.... I dont see that combo being the better 200 mill spent than rendon. (And I say that not being nearly as pumped about rendon as most of the board).

Also add the fact that this franchise hasn’t had a legitimate 3rd baseman since Troy Glaus. He solves a huge problem this organization has had since the early 2000s. Donaldson is great, but  rendon is better and like you said, he’s in his prime. He’s a flat out stud. I wanted Cole as much as everyone else, but I think the Rendon signing is better. 

[Lou]

5 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

Also add the fact that this franchise hasn’t had a legitimate 3rd baseman since Troy Glaus. He solves a huge problem this organization has had since the early 2000s. Donaldson is great, but  rendon is better and like you said, he’s in his prime. He’s a flat out stud. I wanted Cole as much as everyone else, but I think the Rendon signing is better. 

Bruin.

 

(I'm summoning my inner AO)

[beatlesrule]

11 hours ago, VariousCrap said:

Gubicza is still saying on Twitter that the Angels will get a front end of the rotation pitcher this off-season.

8 hours ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Its a fair take to say the angels would have been better off doing that. Solve multiple problems, etc.

What i think it misses is that rendon is in his prime. And every angel fan is acutely aware of how scarce available star 3Bs are.

Adding to that. I wanted Dallas K. Still let down we didnt get him. But Bumgarner I didnt. Always liked him, and he would have been a boost. But hes on the back end of his career....his prime is behind him.

Wouldnt be horrible (maybe it ends that way), but youre not getting the WS hero the brand name carries.

And Donaldson....yes, great year last year. But how much longer does that last? 

So, I too would have preferred signing multiple guys instead of one.( although for Cole i would have been happy). But the 3 guys listed in that take.... I dont see that combo being the better 200 mill spent than rendon. (And I say that not being nearly as pumped about rendon as most of the board).

Aside from being injured in 2018, Donaldson has been good to great every year. He's not slowing down. I wouldn't have minded him at 3rd for the next 3-4 years at all. Glad to have Rendon though and as Chuck pointed out, the combo of Rendon, Teheran and Bundy should be more productive than Madbum, Dallas and Donaldson and are all younger. Then again, difficult to compare contracts at this moment regarding years especially.

@hangin n wangin I brought up that same thing regarding no real 3rd baseman since Glaus and was told that Figgins, Callaspo, Freese and others held down the hot corner no problem. Looking at WAR at 3rd since Glaus left, I don't think it hurt the Angels as bad as we think since Glaus wasn't resigned.

[hangin n wangin]

Just now, Lou said:

Bruin.

 

(I'm summoning my inner AO)

Would you want Trevor Bauer when he becomes available?? Inconsistent career, but we have seen his upside and he’s in his prime. I’ve seen both Pro and con arguments about him on here. 

[ScottM]

I wonder if the Cubs would move Lester. 

[Lou]

3 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

Would you want Trevor Bauer when he becomes available?? Inconsistent career, but we have seen his upside and he’s in his prime. I’ve seen both Pro and con arguments about him on here. 

yes, on 2 conditions:

1. he's better than whoever he would be replacing

2. it doesn't cost me a dime

[ten ocho recon scout]

17 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

Also add the fact that this franchise hasn’t had a legitimate 3rd baseman since Troy Glaus. He solves a huge problem this organization has had since the early 2000s. Donaldson is great, but  rendon is better and like you said, he’s in his prime. He’s a flat out stud. I wanted Cole as much as everyone else, but I think the Rendon signing is better. 

I always argue that Figgins was a very good 3B. But other than that, I do agree.

Beltre was a disaster. I pushed that signing big time when nost of the board wanted crawford. I didnt in any way expect beltre to do here what he did in texas. I was thinking more like "better than seattle, worse than boston. But the point was we had no in house solution, and none figured to become available over the next few years.

So like now, rendon makes sense, like beltre did.

Essentially, cole screwed everything up. And its nobodies fault. Just didnt work out.

The other two that made the most sense were strassburg and wheeler.... and neither of those was happening.

Rendon helps us more long term than the leftover FA pitchers this winter. Everyone needs to realize that. Its a huge letdown because we need pitching so bad. But its like marrying a flawed chick because you havent been laid in a bit. Guys like madbum and ryu would have been that second wife you were with for 2 years. 

[Second Base]

29 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

I always argue that Figgins was a very good 3B. But other than that, I do agree.

Beltre was a disaster. I pushed that signing big time when nost of the board wanted crawford. I didnt in any way expect beltre to do here what he did in texas. I was thinking more like "better than seattle, worse than boston. But the point was we had no in house solution, and none figured to become available over the next few years.

So like now, rendon makes sense, like beltre did.

Essentially, cole screwed everything up. And its nobodies fault. Just didnt work out.

The other two that made the most sense were strassburg and wheeler.... and neither of those was happening.

Rendon helps us more long term than the leftover FA pitchers this winter. Everyone needs to realize that. Its a huge letdown because we need pitching so bad. But its like marrying a flawed chick because you havent been laid in a bit. Guys like madbum and ryu would have been that second wife you were with for 2 years. 

[Lou]

4 minutes ago, Second Base said:

I always argue that Figgins was a very good 3B. 

the Mariners agree

[Second Base]

3 minutes ago, Lou said:

the Mariners agree

Wait what? I never said that! Why the heck are you making it look like that?

[Lou]

1 minute ago, Second Base said:

Wait what? I never said that! Why the heck are you making it look like that?

Ha. no idea how that happened.

I bet it was recon and his shady cop thing

[tdawg87]

Ocho has a small weiner.

[Second Base]

13 minutes ago, Lou said:

Ha. no idea how that happened.

I bet it was recon and his shady cop thing

Marines don't do that to each other.... Sometimes

[beatlesrule]

MLBTR AL West remaining needs

Los Angeles Angels:

As mentioned above, the Angels made one of the offseason’s most noteworthy splashes when they signed Rendon. Many expected the Angels to hand out a $200MM-plus contract this winter, but the popular belief was that money would go to a pitcher (Cole or Stephen Strasburg). The Angels struck out on Cole, Strasburg and $100MM-plus man Zack Wheeler (now a Phillie), but with Rendon in tow, they boast arguably baseball’s premier one-two punch of position players in him and the transcendent Mike Trout. The supporting cast behind those two isn’t bad, either, with DH Shohei Ohtani, shortstop Andrelton Simmons, second baseman David Fletcher and left fielder Justin Upton as quality complements. Furthermore, star outfield prospect Jo Adell gaining on a major league spot.

If there’s one serious issue among the Angels’ cast of hitters, it’s behind the plate. The only catchers on the Angels’ 40-man roster are Max Stassi and Anthony Bemboom, and that probably isn’t going to cut it. They have, however, shown interest in boosting their cause from outside. Either Chirinos or Castro (or, although it’s less likely, a trade for the Cubs’ Willson Contreras) would go a long way toward giving them one of the most formidable groups of position players in baseball.

Of course, as was the case when the offseason began, the Angels still need front-of-the-rotation help. Sure, they’ve done well to land Dylan Bundy and Julio Teheran as competent innings eaters, and Ohtani will factor in again after missing all of 2019 (as a pitcher) while recovering from Tommy John surgery. Andrew Heaney and Griffin Canning are still in the mix, which is a plus, but there’s no proven ace in the fold. Problem is that it may be too late to find one. Boyd, Ray, Chris Archer (whom new manager Joe Maddon knows from their time in Tampa Bay) and David Price (who still has three years and $96MM left on his contract) are among the top options on the trade market, but all come with question marks.

Fortunately for the Angels, they’re still more than $20MM under the luxury tax, so there’s room for them to make further upgrades even after grabbing Rendon, Bundy and Teheran.

 

[ten ocho recon scout]

3 hours ago, Second Base said:

Marines don't do that to each other.... Sometimes

Its not gay if youre underway. 

[ten ocho recon scout]

3 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

Ocho has a small weiner.

More of a outie belly button

[tdawg87]

Oh well look at Mr. Big Dick over here gloating.

Fuck off.

[angelsnationtalk]

8 hours ago, beatlesrule said:

MLBTR AL West remaining needs

Los Angeles Angels:

As mentioned above, the Angels made one of the offseason’s most noteworthy splashes when they signed Rendon. Many expected the Angels to hand out a $200MM-plus contract this winter, but the popular belief was that money would go to a pitcher (Cole or Stephen Strasburg). The Angels struck out on Cole, Strasburg and $100MM-plus man Zack Wheeler (now a Phillie), but with Rendon in tow, they boast arguably baseball’s premier one-two punch of position players in him and the transcendent Mike Trout. The supporting cast behind those two isn’t bad, either, with DH Shohei Ohtani, shortstop Andrelton Simmons, second baseman David Fletcher and left fielder Justin Upton as quality complements. Furthermore, star outfield prospect Jo Adell gaining on a major league spot.

If there’s one serious issue among the Angels’ cast of hitters, it’s behind the plate. The only catchers on the Angels’ 40-man roster are Max Stassi and Anthony Bemboom, and that probably isn’t going to cut it. They have, however, shown interest in boosting their cause from outside. Either Chirinos or Castro (or, although it’s less likely, a trade for the Cubs’ Willson Contreras) would go a long way toward giving them one of the most formidable groups of position players in baseball.

Of course, as was the case when the offseason began, the Angels still need front-of-the-rotation help. Sure, they’ve done well to land Dylan Bundy and Julio Teheran as competent innings eaters, and Ohtani will factor in again after missing all of 2019 (as a pitcher) while recovering from Tommy John surgery. Andrew Heaney and Griffin Canning are still in the mix, which is a plus, but there’s no proven ace in the fold. Problem is that it may be too late to find one. Boyd, Ray, Chris Archer (whom new manager Joe Maddon knows from their time in Tampa Bay) and David Price (who still has three years and $96MM left on his contract) are among the top options on the trade market, but all come with question marks.

Fortunately for the Angels, they’re still more than $20MM under the luxury tax, so there’s room for them to make further upgrades even after grabbing Rendon, Bundy and Teheran.

 

That’s pretty sad that David Price is a top option. $32M/yr is really steep. I’d feel better if Boston ate $15M/yr so we’d owe him $17M, but there’s no way that happens. 
 

[Stradling]

29 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

That’s pretty sad that David Price is a top option. $32M/yr is really steep. I’d feel better if Boston ate $15M/yr so we’d owe him $17M, but there’s no way that happens. 
 

There’s no way the Angels take on his entire contract.  So if you’re worried about the Angels trading for him and his $96 million contract, just stop.  If Boston is really trying to shed payroll they’ll have to eat part of his contract.  My guess is any team getting him will look at how much Keuchel or Hamels is getting paid and start from there. 

[hangin n wangin]

1 hour ago, angelsnationtalk said:

That’s pretty sad that David Price is a top option. $32M/yr is really steep. I’d feel better if Boston ate $15M/yr so we’d owe him $17M, but there’s no way that happens. 
 

you couldn’t possibly think the Angels would take on the whole contract, right??