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calscuf

Canceling Student Loan Debt

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I’m sure we’ve touched on this before but as a few democratic hopefuls are proposing canceling outstanding student loan debt I thought I’d express my opinions without searching for an older thread.

I’m not sure, on a societal level, what the benefit of this could be.  Obviously for those who previously made a commitment to borrow money that now doesn’t have to be paid back get a windfall, but what about everyone else?  I assume all of our taxes are what will pay for this $640,000,000,000 proposal.  

My issue with this, aside from the tax cost, is that it sends a message to an already “problematic” cohort, namely millennials, that they aren’t responsible for a financial commitment they’ve made.  I don’t see that as setting a good example for anyone.  

If you want to run on making college more affordable or free, fine, do that.   

There is a massive issue with personal responsibility in this country and running on a platform that encourages people to take less personal responsibility is problematic.  

How this can be seen as anything but pandering, I don’t know.

And what about all those people that made a commitment and then paid off student loan debt?  F*ck em for being responsible? Or are we going to pay them back all the loan payments they’ve already made?

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I guess this one really bothers me because you’d think the democrats would be unifying to get rid of the Dipshit in Chief, but no, “let’s throw out some ideas that will totally alienate moderates and maybe we can get Dipshit re-elected ourselves!

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It's never going to happen. As someone who still owes a significant amount of student loan debt, the idea is very appealing, but I also recognize it's unrealistic.

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26 minutes ago, Taylor said:

It's never going to happen. As someone who still owes a significant amount of student loan debt, the idea is very appealing, but I also recognize it's unrealistic.

You’re a Wave, if I recall correctly... yeah?   That school ain’t cheap.

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41 minutes ago, calscuf said:

I guess this one really bothers me because you’d think the democrats would be unifying to get rid of the Dipshit in Chief, but no, “let’s throw out some ideas that will totally alienate moderates and maybe we can get Dipshit re-elected ourselves!

Someone needs to campaign on making Islam our national religion.  You know...  shore up the woke base.

 

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I’m not a finance guy but I agree with every point you made, cals. It’s going to be a disaster. What next, wiping out all credit card debt? No more mortgages or rent? This is indeed a very slippery slope.

the plan for free public college is also going to be problematic. The plan is to have Wall Street pay for it. Okay, so Wall Street gets taxed to pay for it. Since these are people and businesses who thrive on making big profits that they don’t want to lose, it means price increases on whatever products or services they provide. That means you and I will end up paying for college to be free. Smart and successful business people aren’t simply going to sit back and accept whatever financial loss these new taxes are going to cost them. 

Its going to be the same effect on consumers with increasing the minimum wage so much.

 

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I deeply, deeply dislike the idea that there’s some “problem” with millennials.  Millennials have been absolutely fuc*ked.  Whether you want to talk about employment or housing or whatever.  I understand reservations about student loan debt being wiped out.  But it’s also true that many of these loans are predatory in nature.  Loans being made to young people that don’t really understand what they’re getting into when they sign the dotted line.  You can get one of these loans when you’re 17.    

The principle issue is that young people are sold a bill of goods that is complete bullshit.  That they must go get one of these insanely expensive degrees.  How much did you pay for school Tank ? 

And then at the end of the tunnel is some good job that leads to some bullshit imaginary American Dream.  Sure, it works out for some people but for a ton of people it does not.  It’s a fu*cked system.  

Anyway.  Shit sucks. Student debt is a problem.  Is there a better plan then wiping out student debt ? Maybe.  I would be interested to hear other solutions.  I think that it’s pretty tough argue against the idea that alleviating the burden around these people’s necks would be a big time stimulus for the economy.  One that actually helps regular people and not the fu*cking rich only.  Which is the only group that ever gets any help in this country. 

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47 minutes ago, the dude abides said:

You’re a Wave, if I recall correctly... yeah?   That school ain’t cheap.

Indeed. As an 18-year-old kid, I had no concept of the cost for anything. Even with my parents helping me, I still graduated with close to $50,000 in student loan debt.

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1 hour ago, calscuf said:

 

My issue with this, aside from the tax cost, is that it sends a message to an already “problematic” cohort, namely millennials, that they aren’t responsible for a financial commitment they’ve made.  I don’t see that as setting a good example for anyone.  

If you want to run on making college more affordable or free, fine, do that.   

There is a massive issue with personal responsibility in this country and running on a platform that encourages people to take less personal responsibility is problematic.  

 

While I understand completely what you are saying, I'm not sure that it's necessarily true.  It seems as though many spout these talking points (in bold print), but I'm not sold on the hasty generalization of these groups. Indeed, it seems that these phrases are generated for us to use in our discussions with others, so that the illogical nature of the statements become fact. 

I owe money still, and hell yeah, if my debt were covered, that would be cool. But I'm also more than okay with the personal responsibility of paying my debt.  The issue, as I understand it, is that universities and colleges have caught on to the economics of higher education (supply and demand) and are quite willing to exploit students to make money off of them.

In all, I'm not sure what the answer is, but it certainly isn't limited to the demand side of the issue.  The answer must also reside in the supply side, and if the government needs to regulate it due to the relative naivete of the students, so be it. 

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1 hour ago, calscuf said:

I guess this one really bothers me because you’d think the democrats would be unifying to get rid of the Dipshit in Chief, but no, “let’s throw out some ideas that will totally alienate moderates and maybe we can get Dipshit re-elected ourselves!

This is it, exactly.

I despise today's Republican party. I was a registered Republican the last 20 years, and this year went unaffiliated. I don't see myself ever going back.

But my God, the left is just so dumb. They want to create a dependent state. And I hate socialism even more than Trumpism. I wish I could like one of their candidates, but other than Biden, I think they are all just too liberal. I really hate what they stand for.

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I went to law school and incurred $100,000 in debt.  I paid it back.

Student loans aren't f’ing predatory.  Cmon man.  The rates are like nothing and what you make of your degree is up to you.  There are jobs out there.  If you don’t want to borrow the money, don’t go to college.  

Either college sucks and isn’t worth it and saddles young people with worthless debt or it’s necessary to get the good jobs.  YOU CANNOT ARGUE BOTH.

And you millennials are showing your stripes.  You really do want shit for free.  Maybe cut your hair and quit the avocados?

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There are plenty of good jobs that don't require college.

There are also lots of good jobs that are really hard to get into without a nice degree. But it's not a requirement to rack up 100k worth.

 

A buddy of mine got his computer science degree at Western Governors University. A fully accredited online school. Tuition is about 6k a year, and he's a senior software engineer for Netflix in the bay area. He pulls down some serious coin.

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See millennials, Gen X’ers perfected lazy, whiny disillusionment for the years when we were like 15-25.  We were awesome at it.  They made a bunch of movies about it!

Then we all decided (about 1992-1995) that life would be better if we did shit and made some money.  So we did that.  And now we are f*cking your millennial chicks.

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And other than pandering, someone explain to me why this would be good for America as a whole?

It’s certainly not food for Joe Lower Middle Class, who the Dems should be targeting.

And why pander to a group that is already strongly in your court?  College educated millennials?  They’re probably already 70% democratic.  Honestly as a political decision this might be the dumbest ever.

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Some of the loans are absolutely predatory.  It’s great that there are examples of people that make it work.  MAGA mentioned his friend.  That is cool.  No doubt.  But you guys are wrong imagining that these are typical examples.  

Law schools for example, in the last 10-15 years these schools massively mislead many, many people with bullshit data about post graduation prospects.  Just recently there was a law school in Whittier that folded up.  Fuc*ked a lot of those students.  You may have heard about this stuff Cals.  Anyway, I get it’s funny to call millennials pussys or whatever.  But they really have been stuck with all kinds of bullshit. 

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19 minutes ago, calscuf said:

Millennials.  What homos.

I kinda dig what they’re doing.  The whole “fvck company loyalty” and the FIRE movement (as long as it’s fat or moderate).  Kudos to them if the can make it work.

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6 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

Law schools for example, in the last 10-15 years these schools massively mislead many, many people with bullshit data about post graduation prospects.  Just recently there was a law school in Whittier that folded up.  Fuc*ked a lot of those students.  You may have heard about this stuff Cals.  Anyway, I get it’s funny to call millennials pussys or whatever.  But they really have been stuck with all kinds of bullshit. 

With all due respect, and I mean with all due respect, you don’t know what the hell you are talking about.

If some dummy paid $100,000 to a law school that folded, dude wasn’t gonna pass the bar anyways.  That’s not predatory, that’s just Darwinism.  Even shitty, shitty law schools don’t fold.  

If you pay for Hollywood Upstairs Law College, you get what you pay for.

I know all about the law profession.  I made $35k as a lawyer my first job out of law school.  I was f*cking happy to have a job and learn.  That was 16 years ago so it’s not like $35K was a lot.

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2 minutes ago, calscuf said:

With all due respect, and I mean with all due respect, you don’t know what the hell you are talking about.

If some dummy paid $100,000 to a law school that folded, dude wasn’t gonna pass the bar anyways.  That’s not predatory, that’s just Darwinism.  Even shitty, shitty law schools don’t fold.  

If you pay for Hollywood Upstairs Law College, you get what you pay for.

I know all about the law profession.  I made $35k as a lawyer my first job out of law school.  I was f*cking happy to have a job and learn.  That was 16 years ago so it’s not like $35K was a lot.

I don’t know what to tell you man.  The situation is what it is.  I’ve read about and been told that there are just way more lawyers out there now then actual law jobs available.  These shit law schools get their money whether they pass the bar or not whether there’s realistically a job out there or not.  I understand that a lot of firms won’t even look at you unless you’ve graduated from one of the top tier schools.  This is what I’ve heard.  I’m not an attorney so all I can speak to is what I’ve read and been told.  I’ll defer to your knowledge of it I guess. 

Anyway this is kind of what I’m talking about when I say that there’s a bullshit bill of goods being sold.  If you want to call it social Darwinism. I mean.  I guess. 

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1 hour ago, UndertheHalo said:

I deeply, deeply dislike the idea that there’s some “problem” with millennials.  Millennials have been absolutely fuc*ked.  Whether you want to talk about employment or housing or whatever.  I understand reservations about student loan debt being wiped out.  But it’s also true that many of these loans are predatory in nature.  Loans being made to young people that don’t really understand what they’re getting into when they sign the dotted line.  You can get one of these loans when you’re 17.    

The principle issue is that young people are sold a bill of goods that is complete bullshit.  That they must go get one of these insanely expensive degrees.  How much did you pay for school Tank ? 

And then at the end of the tunnel is some good job that leads to some bullshit imaginary American Dream.  Sure, it works out for some people but for a ton of people it does not.  It’s a fu*cked system.  

Anyway.  Shit sucks. Student debt is a problem.  Is there a better plan then wiping out student debt ? Maybe.  I would be interested to hear other solutions.  I think that it’s pretty tough argue against the idea that alleviating the burden around these people’s necks would be a big time stimulus for the economy.  One that actually helps regular people and not the fu*cking rich only.  Which is the only group that ever gets any help in this country. 

Or they could go to Jr college, work and pay for it at the same time.  Then make a better decision rather than get a liberal arts degree from a crazy expensive college.  There are plenty of resources online to let them know how much money they will make coming out of college.  Once again, it is taking away personal accountability. 

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5 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

I don’t know what to tell you man.  The situation is what it is.  I’ve read about and been told that there are just way more lawyers out there now then actual law jobs available.  These shit law schools get their money whether they pass the bar or not whether there’s realistically a job out there or not.  I understand that a lot of firms won’t even look at you unless you’ve graduated from one of the top tier schools.  This is what I’ve heard.  I’m not an attorney so all I can speak to is what I’ve read and been told.  I’ll defer to your knowledge of it I guess. 

Anyway this is kind of what I’m talking about when I say that there’s a bullshit bill of goods being sold.  If you want to call it social Darwinism. I mean.  I guess. 

My point is: Than don’t go to one of these shitty law schools.  Look at the bar pass rates for the schools you are taking about.   At what point do we consider those dummies as victims or just f*cking dummies?  

Not every idiot who loses a dollar is a victim.  Sometimes, they’re just an idiot.

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