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Dallas Keuchel


Troll Daddy

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1 hour ago, Jay said:

I hope we sign him just to see Doc and Stradling's heads explode.

meh.  he's still a solid pitcher and likely to be for at least a couple years.  

I'd expect CJ Wilson level production at best.  

Everyone needs to realize that getting Keuchel now likely negates any chance of getting someone like Cole, Bumgarner or Arrenado next year and that we'll be paying him 20+ mil for his age 33 and 34 seasons for what is likely to be mid to back end rotation production by that time.  

It wouldn't make a ton of sense to me though and would be out of character for Eppler to make a move like that.  

I know Gio Gonzalez is a couple years older, but over the past 3 years his era+ is 112.  Keuchel's is 106.  

You want to add some depth and stability to the rotation?  Grab Gio at 2/18.  Not Keuchel at 4/70.  plus you wouldn't lose a pick or intl money.  He also doesn't limit future plans in any real way.  

 

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1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

meh.  he's still a solid pitcher and likely to be for at least a couple years.  

I'd expect CJ Wilson level production at best.  

Everyone needs to realize that getting Keuchel now likely negates any chance of getting someone like Cole, Bumgarner or Arrenado next year and that we'll be paying him 20+ mil for his age 33 and 34 seasons for what is likely to be mid to back end rotation production by that time.  

It wouldn't make a ton of sense to me though and would be out of character for Eppler to make a move like that.  

I know Gio Gonzalez is a couple years older, but over the past 3 years his era+ is 112.  Keuchel's is 106.  

You want to add some depth and stability to the rotation?  Grab Gio at 2/18.  Not Keuchel at 4/70.  plus you wouldn't lose a pick or intl money.  He also doesn't limit future plans in any real way.  

 

Was it in character for Eppler to trade our two top pitching prospects for Simmons?

There’s no guarantee that they’ll sign any big name FA’s next off season. 

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2 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

Was it in character for Eppler to trade our two top pitching prospects for Simmons?

There’s no guarantee that they’ll sign any big name FA’s next off season. 

We had no idea what his character was since that was his first move as a GM.   

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16 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

Was it in character for Eppler to trade our two top pitching prospects for Simmons?

There’s no guarantee that they’ll sign any big name FA’s next off season. 

that was 3 years ago and the team was different then.  the pitching staff hadn't yet been decimated with injury and we weren't at the end of a rebuild.  

the only thing you are guaranteed with Keuchel is spending a lot of money.  For his age and trajectory, you are likely going to get a guy with an era in the high threes and maybe even low fours from the day he toes the mound for the halos.  

I don't think Eppler is looking for high priced consolation prizes.  If there isn't a player that he really wants, he'll move on to a one year deal.  

What do you envision Dallas Keuchel being for his age 31-34 seasons?  

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21 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

that was 3 years ago and the team was different then.  the pitching staff hadn't yet been decimated with injury and we weren't at the end of a rebuild.  

the only thing you are guaranteed with Keuchel is spending a lot of money.  For his age and trajectory, you are likely going to get a guy with an era in the high threes and maybe even low fours from the day he toes the mound for the halos.  

I don't think Eppler is looking for high priced consolation prizes.  If there isn't a player that he really wants, he'll move on to a one year deal.  

What do you envision Dallas Keuchel being for his age 31-34 seasons?  

I see Keuchel as being a solid front end of the rotation starter and being able to give the team 180+ innings a season. 

So is it your belief the Angels have no interest in Keuchel?

btw this is just a discussion ... doubtful they sign him but just my bold prediction. 

 

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9 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Yes.  He traded for a player entering his prime with an elite skill set.  He gave up Newcomb who had control issues and upside.  

The trade worked out great ... but seeing what he has done since the trade makes it a little out of character imo. The trade was his boldest move since becoming GM. 

I don’t think anyone here can say they’re completely satisfied with our starting pitching going into the season ... except you of course :)

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1 hour ago, Troll Daddy said:

I see Keuchel as being a solid front end of the rotation starter and being able to give the team 180+ innings a season. 

So is it your belief the Angels have no interest in Keuchel?

btw this is just a discussion ... doubtful they sign him but just my bold prediction. 

 

maybe that's the discrepancy in our want to sign him.  

I think he's a middle of the rotation starter and could decline into a #4 ish type over the next two years.  

And I don't think they are interested in Keuchel.  At least not as his price.  

Every team has a window, but so does every player.  The goal is to try and get the two to match up as much as possible.  I don't think Keuchel's window does that for us.    

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1 hour ago, Troll Daddy said:

The trade worked out great ... but seeing what he has done since the trade makes it a little out of character imo. The trade was his boldest move since becoming GM. 

I don’t think anyone here can say they’re completely satisfied with our starting pitching going into the season ... except you of course :)

I’m not saying I’m satisfied, I’m just not sold that Keuchel is the solution.   I’m also not sure Skaggs and Heaney don’t out perform him this year and going forward.  

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2 hours ago, Stradling said:

I’m not saying I’m satisfied, I’m just not sold that Keuchel is the solution.   I’m also not sure Skaggs and Heaney don’t out perform him this year and going forward.  

Keuchel would be about the surest pitcher we can count on next season. Btw I thought you posted earlier that you have no problem with Keuchel on the team. 

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8 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

Keuchel would be about the surest pitcher we can count on next season. Btw I thought you posted earlier that you have no problem with Keuchel on the team. 

surest pitcher is almost an oxymoron.  

the guy is entering his age 31 season.  he's already show cracks.  he's not going to be what he was.  There's actually an reasonable chance he's not very good.  

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21 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

surest pitcher is almost an oxymoron.  

the guy is entering his age 31 season.  he's already show cracks.  he's not going to be what he was.  There's actually an reasonable chance he's not very good.  

You can say the same thing about most of the top pitchers in the game. He’s considered the top FA pitcher available now by many in the game.

There’s not too many sure things when it comes to pitching. 

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5 hours ago, Troll Daddy said:

You can say the same thing about most of the top pitchers in the game. He’s considered the top FA pitcher available now by many in the game.

There’s not too many sure things when it comes to pitching. 

exactly why you don't get him just because he's the best of what's left.  You get him if you have real interest.  I don't think the Angels do and I hope they don't mostly because I don't like the idea of giving out 3 years or more for mid tier pitchers on the wrong side of 30.  Something that's close to a sure thing is that those contracts don't work.  I get making a play for Corbin because he's two years younger so his 4th year would be age 32.  6 years was too long though.  If you're paying him silly money in the 2023 when Pujols and Upton are off the books then fine.  I don't want to do that with Keuchel at age 33 when you've still got both and at age 34 when you've still got Upton.  

and it tells you something that he's still available.  that he has to wait to see if the Phils are desperate enough to pay him more than anyone else would.  

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1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

exactly why you don't get him just because he's the best of what's left.  You get him if you have real interest.  I don't think the Angels do and I hope they don't mostly because I don't like the idea of giving out 3 years or more for mid tier pitchers on the wrong side of 30.  Something that's close to a sure thing is that those contracts don't work.  I get making a play for Corbin because he's two years younger so his 4th year would be age 32.  6 years was too long though.  If you're paying him silly money in the 2023 when Pujols and Upton are off the books then fine.  I don't want to do that with Keuchel at age 33 when you've still got both and at age 34 when you've still got Upton.  

and it tells you something that he's still available.  that he has to wait to see if the Phils are desperate enough to pay him more than anyone else would.  

You must of hated the Verlander trade the Astros made at the 2017 waiver deadline. 

Verlander was 34 years ...  10-8 record with a 3.82 ERA at the time. Astros traded 3 top prospects for him. Astros also took on approximately $45M in salary and possibly another $22M vesting option in 2020. 

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1 hour ago, Erstad Grit said:

Dallas has a reasonable floor of a number 3 pitcher and probably a ceiling of a number 2 pitcher which for us would be pretty solid. I understand why paying him like an ace and losing a draft pick is concerning. 

He will not get paid as a Ace from any team. 

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8 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

You must of hated the Verlander trade the Astros made at the 2017 waiver deadline. 

Verlander was 34 years ...  10-8 record with a 3.82 ERA at the time. Astros traded 3 top prospects for him. Astros also took on approximately $45M in salary and possibly another $22M vesting option in 2020. 

Yep.  Great trade for them because it resulted in them winning the WS.  I thought they paid a high price but felt it made a lot of sense for them at the time.  

the juice is often worth the squeeze for ace level starters whether via trade or free agency.  Even if they're a little long in the tooth.  

Are you implying that getting Verlander at the non waiver trade deadline when the team had an 11.5 game lead in the division on Aug 31st has anything to do with Dallas Keuchel?  Are you also implying that because one player has put great numbers at a certain age that it would somehow make it more likely that a completely different type of pitcher do the same?  

The astros gave up one prospect in the top 100 at the time in Franklin Perez.  Daz Cameron is not a top prospect and Jake Rogers isn't even a prospect at all.  

I hope in 2021 when we have an 11 game lead in the division at the deadline, Dallas Keuchel isn't clogging up the back of our rotation with a high 4's era making 22 mil in the third year of a 4 year deal so we can afford to trade for an ace.  

 

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