2020 Democratic Field

[Crampknees]

7 hours ago, Tank said:

Since that's a Dodger I am all for that idea. 

[JarsOfClay]

18 hours ago, Tank said:

been shopping lately? eaten at a restaurant? bought a house or a car? why do you think prices keep going up? this isn't some mysterious thing being done. rich people didn't get rich accidently; they don't stay rich because they absorb all of the costs of labor and materials. 

This is true when a company is in the business of selling goods, but that's not the case for Wall Street. Trump's tariffs are a good example of prices being passed onto the consumer, which I haven't heard a single republican complain about, yet you cry bloody murder if Bernie does it?

Besides, wall street is a financial institution that holds our money, they don't deal in any goods to increase prices, so I fail to see how this will be passed onto us.

If they try anything fancy, you simply hit them where it hurts, and take your money elsewhere.

Also, there is speculation that Elizabeth Warren will be Bernie's Treasury Secretary, so I doubt Wall Street will try anything to anger these two even more.

[gotbeer]

Sanders releases list of how to pay for his proposals

Quote

The money would come from making the fossil fuel industry pay for “their pollution,” garnering profit from the wholesale of energy, decreasing defense spending, getting new income tax revenue and saving federal and state safety net spending from the jobs created in the plan and enforcing higher taxes on large corporations. 

 

Sounds like taxes are going up and shit is about to get a lot more expensive.

[fan_since79]

Joe's running for Senate, and all along we thought he was aiming for the White House.

https://twitter.com/Wyn1745/status/1232302537933377537?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

[UndertheHalo]

I think Warren is working real hard to fire bomb whatever bridge there was between herself and Sanders.  

[Jason]

43 minutes ago, JarsOfClay said:

This is true when a company is in the business of selling goods, but that's not the case for Wall Street. Trump's tariffs are a good example of prices being passed onto the consumer, which I haven't heard a single republican complain about, yet you cry bloody murder if Bernie does it?

Besides, wall street is a financial institution that holds our money, they don't deal in any goods to increase prices, so I fail to see how this will be passed onto us.

If they try anything fancy, you simply hit them where it hurts, and take your money elsewhere.

Also, there is speculation that Elizabeth Warren will be Bernie's Treasury Secretary, so I doubt Wall Street will try anything to anger these two even more.

You do know normal, middle class people invest in such companies right? Thankfully he will not win and it will not be an issue

Edited February 25, 2020 by Jason

[Adam]

3 hours ago, JarsOfClay said:

Nothing he said was harmful at all. The media is just desperate to find anything they can criticize him about.

Bernie is in a virtual tie with Trump right now in Florida.

Besides Cubans vote Republican anyway, how do you think an empty suit like Rubio keeps getting elected?

Trump will win Florida by 10+% if Bernie is the nominee. You guys assume moderate democrats will vote for him. 

[UndertheHalo]

19 minutes ago, Jason said:

You do know normal, middle class people invest in such companies right? Thankfully he will not win and it will not be an issue

Ah yes, the significant brokerage holdings of the “‘middle class” 

the middle class is a stupid bullshit term that doesn’t mean anything.  I wish people would stop using it. 

Edited February 25, 2020 by UndertheHalo

[UndertheHalo]

I think Bernie would probably have trouble winning Florida generally and it has nothing do with the bullshit pearl clutching about some comments on the quality of Cuban literary programs or health care.  Or like Soviet train stations.  

Electorally, there are very important places where Bernie probably can do better then any other Democrat.  Surely better then an establishment one 

Edited February 25, 2020 by UndertheHalo

[UndertheHalo]

The stock market is currently dropping another 300 points.  It’s almost like the president doesn’t fucking matter. 

[Adam]

11 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

I think Bernie would probably have trouble winning Florida generally and it has nothing do with the bullshit pearl clutching about some comments on the quality of Cuban literary programs or health care.  Or like Soviet train stations.  

Electorally, there are very important places where Bernie probably can do better then any other Democrat.  Surely better then an establishment one 

Unfortunately though for him I think those places are already Blue States. I can't see WI, OH, PA or FL going to him

[UndertheHalo]

1 minute ago, Adam said:

Unfortunately though for him I think those places are already Blue States. I can't see WI, OH, PA or FL going to him

I don’t know.  We’ll see. I think he’s got a decent shot in the first 3.  

Edited February 25, 2020 by UndertheHalo

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

As of 2018 over 55% of the full time US workforce was invested through a pension or 401K plan and total US retirement assets were over 28T.    

[Adam]

Just now, UndertheHalo said:

I don’t know.  We’ll see. I think he’s got a decent shot in the first 3.  

I can't quantify this but it sure feels as though the # of closeted Trump voters is going to be extremely high. I imagine that there are millions of people, who will not publicly or even among friends and family, declare any willingness to vote for Trump. Ostracization is powerful. But in the voting booth...

[Tank]

1 hour ago, JarsOfClay said:

This is true when a company is in the business of selling goods, but that's not the case for Wall Street. Trump's tariffs are a good example of prices being passed onto the consumer, which I haven't heard a single republican complain about, yet you cry bloody murder if Bernie does it?

Besides, wall street is a financial institution that holds our money, they don't deal in any goods to increase prices, so I fail to see how this will be passed onto us.

If they try anything fancy, you simply hit them where it hurts, and take your money elsewhere.

Also, there is speculation that Elizabeth Warren will be Bernie's Treasury Secretary, so I doubt Wall Street will try anything to anger these two even more.

best wishes living in your utopian society.

[St1ck]

13 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

I don’t know.  We’ll see. I think he’s got a decent shot in the first 3.  

Not a chance he wins Ohio. 

[Tank]

8 minutes ago, Catwhoshatinthehat said:

As of 2018 over 55% of the full time US workforce was invested through a pension or 401K plan and total US retirement assets were over 28T.    

including many of us on this forum.

[UndertheHalo]

23 minutes ago, Catwhoshatinthehat said:

As of 2018 over 55% of the full time US workforce was invested through a pension or 401K plan and total US retirement assets were over 28T.    

Lol.  OK.  It’s mostly 401K’s.  Be clear on that. you know, the investment vehicle imposed on people that ties the dignity of their retirement years to the fucking stock market.  Thanks for the reminder that people have 401k’s tho.  
 

anyway the idea that young workers under 45 are principally concerned with this retirement vehicle is something I’ll strongly disagree with. 

Edited February 25, 2020 by UndertheHalo

[UndertheHalo]

18 minutes ago, st1ckboy said:

Not a chance he wins Ohio. 

It’s tight in all the swing states.  Despite what you’ll read on angelswin.com there’s plenty of reason to believe that the president is very much beatable.  I think Adam has a fair point about the difficulty of gauging the presidents real support.  But I think that’s probably true for Sanders as well.  I think that in a Trump vs. Sanders election it’s like 55/45 in favor the president.  Better odds then he had when he won.  

Edited February 25, 2020 by UndertheHalo

[St1ck]

Just now, UndertheHalo said:

It’s tight in all the swing states.  Despite what you’ll read on angelswin.com there’s plenty of reason to believe that the president is very beatable.  I think Adam has a fair point about the difficulty of gauging the president real support.  But I think that’s probably true for Sanders as well.  I think that in a Trump vs. Sanders election it’s like 55/45 in favor the president.  Better odds then he had when he won.  

Trump won OH by 8 points in 2016. No way Sanders makes up that gap. The only way Sanders is going to beat Trump is if he can motivate a massive amount of young voters to actually go out, and vote. That's his base, but the problem with that is that they are unreliable when it comes to voting. 

[UndertheHalo]

2 minutes ago, st1ckboy said:

Trump won OH by 8 points in 2016. No way Sanders makes up that gap. The only way Sanders is going to beat Trump is if he can motivate a massive amount of young voters to actually go out, and vote. That's his base, but the problem with that is that they are unreliable when it comes to voting. 

Yes, that is the entire electoral strategy for him.  So far so good I’d say.  I think if Sanders gets the nomination there will be more energy behind him then Obama had in 2008.  Young people will turn out. 

Edited February 25, 2020 by UndertheHalo

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

15 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

Lol.  OK.  It’s mostly 401K’s.  Be clear on that. you know, the investment vehicle imposed on people that ties the dignity of their retirement years to the fucking stock market.  
 

and the idea that young workers under 45 are principally concerned with this retirement vehicle is something I’ll strongly disagree with. 

You conveniently ignore the overall numbers and zeroed in on pensions of which 22% of the worforce still has a pension of some sort which is ~29M people.  Pensions are going the way of the dinosaur and they aren't coming back any time soon regardless of who gets elected.  The pension obligations many state and cities are saddled with are ridiculous because of the unreal return expectations that many constantly under perform.  So citizens in those cities and states can expect to pay more in future years to meet those pension obligations which is an added cost to taxpayers.  Setting aside pensions over 70% of millennials are saving and investing for retirement.  Disagree until you pass out for all I care but your comment about the significant brokerage holdings of the middle class was wrong.

[UndertheHalo]

11 minutes ago, Catwhoshatinthehat said:

You conveniently ignore the overall numbers and zeroed in on pensions of which 22% of the worforce still has a pension of some sort which is ~29M people.  Pensions are going the way of the dinosaur and they aren't coming back any time soon regardless of who gets elected.  The pension obligations many state and cities are saddled with are ridiculous because of the unreal return expectations that many constantly under perform.  So citizens in those cities and states can expect to pay more in future years to meet those pension obligations which is an added cost to taxpayers.  Setting aside pensions over 70% of millennials are saving and investing for retirement.  Disagree until you pass out for all I care but your comment about the significant brokerage holdings of the middle class was wrong.

I’d say that you are making a wrong headed point in bad faith for the convenience of your argument.  It’s stupid to  group peoples 401K’s (a benefit that people receive from their employers - as you know) in with other investment vehicles that are otherwise used to generate wealth right now.  And the pension thing is ridiculous and you know it.  Ya, I have a “pension” as well.  I think you know exactly what the value of a lot of younger people’s “pensions” are.  

Edited February 25, 2020 by UndertheHalo

[Tank]

2 hours ago, RallyMo said:

Oh lord, Tank is using cy's meme dealer's conservative brother for material.

at least you could understand mine.

the next one cy posts that is understandable will be his first one.

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

What's the wrong headed point when I respond that 55% of the US workforce is invested in the ~28T in US retirement assets that are invested?  As of March 2019 that number was up over 29T of which 5.7T or 20% was from 401K plans. I'd criticize your facts but you don't actually post any you make claims based on feelings and then back pedal or nitpick something from a post that wasn't there.