If 2019 doesn’t go as planned, is it time to consider a rebuild?

[Halokingfish]

49 minutes ago, Torridd said:

I don't see how Trout could make such a demand. More than being selfish, which seems to go against any personality trait we've heard that he has, how can you guarantee getting into the playoffs?

Trout does seem like a really nice person. He doesn’t seem like the guy that would voice his displeasure through the media. He did tell the papers that he wants to win at least. Winning is important to him, and if a better opportunity comes up elsewhere for him to win we should be worried. 

[Lou]

which player doesn't want to win?

[Halokingfish]

39 minutes ago, nando714 said:

Weren’t we already rebuilding ?

I just started following baseball, especially the Angels last season and I had a lot to learn during the offseason. I had to ask some of my more experienced Angels fan friends about the team the last few years and they told me to an extent yes, the club was rebuilding but there was never a major fire sale like what is happening in Seattle right now. My friends think the best way to build a long time winner is have a full rebuild instead of the mediocrity of the Angels hovering around 500. I read old articles on the team and Mr. Moreno said there would be no tanks. However, some of the current roster is headed to free agency soon and my question was if we can’t field a contender this year should we hit reset

 

[greginpsca]

A team like the Angels  with a $179 mil payroll doesn’t need to go thru a massive rebuild. A small market team with a payroll of $90 mil generally has no choice at a certain point to completely start over. Either way, a strong farm system is the foundation to success.

[Lou]

1 minute ago, greginpsca said:

A team like the Angels  with a $179 mil payroll doesn’t need to go thru a massive rebuild. A small market team with a payroll of $90 mil generally has no choice at a certain point to completely start over. Either way, a strong farm system is the foundation to success.

those teams with a $90 million payroll can easily increase their payrolls to $150 million. They have billionaire owners who choose not to, however.

i have absolutely no sympathy for them. 

[beatlesrule]

20 minutes ago, Lou said:

which player doesn't want to win?

A lot of players only care about money. Greinke flat out said whoever pays me the most I'm going to play for. A-Rod didn't sign those massive deals with winning first in mind. Vernon Wells was too blessed to be stressed.  Hamilton  just needed money for drugs. I can go on and on. 

[floplag]

10 hours ago, Ace-Of-Diamonds said:

Wouldn't to be the GM or owner that let Trout leave as a free agent because they didn't have the balls to release Pujols and surround Trout with enough talent to win in the post season.

SO much this.  The only thing worse that being the GM that trades Trout, is being the one that let him go and got nothing for it.  

[Lou]

3 minutes ago, beatlesrule said:

A lot of players only care about money. Greinke flat out said whoever pays me the most I'm going to play for. A-Rod didn't sign those massive deals with winning first in mind. Vernon Wells was too blessed to be stressed.  Hamilton  just needed money for drugs. I can go on and on. 

that doesn't mean they didn't like winning. 

[floplag]

1 hour ago, Torridd said:

I don't see how Trout could make such a demand. More than being selfish, which seems to go against any personality trait we've heard that he has, how can you guarantee getting into the playoffs?

No one can make such a guarantee, i dont think thats what anyone has suggested.  I think what people including myself has said is that we need to make a legitimate effort.  If we sign some people, make a trade or two, this team can at minimum make a wildcard or better playoff run.  No, we might not get into the LCS or WS, but isnt making the playoffs better than not?  Trout himself has made it clear he wants to play meaningful baseball, we need to give him that.  If we are unwilling or unable to do so, then we must consider options logically.

[Halokingfish]

16 minutes ago, greginpsca said:

A team like the Angels  with a $179 mil payroll doesn’t need to go thru a massive rebuild. A small market team with a payroll of $90 mil generally has no choice at a certain point to completely start over. Either way, a strong farm system is the foundation to success.

Isn’t the best way to get the best prospects through a rebuild? So that way when the prospects are ready you only have to sign a couple free agents. Instead if you have limited talent from your farm and want to be a long term winner you have to hand out stupid long term expensive deals to guys that may have already played their best years and the team’s hands get tied up with so much guaranteed money tied up in bad places. My friends mentioned Pujols and Hamilton, the Wells trade and some guy named Gary Matthews Jr. If we were to through a full rebuild if we had a bad 2019, shouldn’t we be done rebuilding around the time Houston and Oakland contention is over?

[Lou]

sorry, but there is no way you're new to baseball 

[Halokingfish]

Just now, Lou said:

sorry, but there is no way you're new to baseball 

I’m a fast learner bro. Deal with it. 

[Lou]

3 minutes ago, Halokingfish said:

I’m a fast learner bro. Deal with it. 

 

[Lou]

lol @ "some guy named Gary Matthews, Jr "

[beatlesrule]

4 hours ago, Lou said:

that doesn't mean they didn't like winning. 

Players go to last place teams/teams going nowhere all the time.  If they wanted to win, they would sign with better teams that either make the playoffs year after year or with teams that are putting together a winning club or are right there knocking on the door.  Free agents wouldn't sign with crappy teams like the Padres, Pirates, Reds, Orioles, Marlins etc if they cared about winning.  Hell, Stanton signed that extension because it was worth 325 million. Not because the Marlins were winning games and going to the playoffs. Votto signed a 251 million dollar extension with the Reds in 2012. Check out how many times they've gone to the playoffs and their record since then.

[Lou]

my point was that those two things aren't mutually exclusive

[Angel Oracle]

5 hours ago, Lou said:

those teams with a $90 million payroll can easily increase their payrolls to $150 million. They have billionaire owners who choose not to, however.

i have absolutely no sympathy for them. 

This

Wulff and that other A'th owner are disgraces to the game.   Billionaire slumlords is right.

[beatlesrule]

I just don't agree that all players want to win. I think it's probably just a bonus to many.  Most free agents are all about the money.  Pujols wouldn't have signed with the Angels if he all he wanted to do was win.  He left a team that just won the World Series.  There are soo many examples over the years of players signing with the team that paid them the most.  None put winning ahead of their paycheck. Hosmer signed an 8 year deal with the Padres. Yeah, he sure wants to win.