The Mariners staff is falling apart

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

https://www.baseball...am-in-two-acts/

Short Relief: The Death of a Baseball Team, in Two Acts

 

Four our score and one year ago our fathers brought forth in this state, a new franchise, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that we are just as good as the rest of those jabronis on the East Coast.

Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that team, or any team so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of Safeco Field, as a final resting place for those who here gave so much time that that project might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this. Except for Robert Andino, he can screw off.

But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate — we can not consecrate — we can not hallow — this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us — that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion — that we here highly resolve that these players shall not have withered away the last years of their arbitration in vain — that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom — and that a team organized around the will of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.

[Second Base]

Honest question for all of us Angel fans. Do remember how enameled we all were by Dipoto? Now we see the joke that he is, is Billy Eppler not nearly as good as we believe him to be?

We're all homers to an extent. But have we glossed over the failures of his teams he's built in the name of being Angel fans?

[Lou]

22 minutes ago, Second Base said:

Do remember how enameled we all were by Dipoto? 

scottyb ? 

[eligrba]

25 minutes ago, Second Base said:

Honest question for all of us Angel fans. Do remember how enameled we all were by Dipoto? Now we see the joke that he is, is Billy Eppler not nearly as good as we believe him to be?

We're all homers to an extent. But have we glossed over the failures of his teams he's built in the name of being Angel fans?

What if the pitcher's stayed healthy?  I think we would have a different perspective if the Angels had healthy pitching the last couple of years.

 

[halomatt]

29 minutes ago, Second Base said:

Honest question for all of us Angel fans. Do remember how enameled we all were by Dipoto? Now we see the joke that he is, is Billy Eppler not nearly as good as we believe him to be?

We're all homers to an extent. But have we glossed over the failures of his teams he's built in the name of being Angel fans?

I was pretty lacquered up! 

[tdawg87]

43 minutes ago, Second Base said:

Honest question for all of us Angel fans. Do remember how enameled we all were by Dipoto? Now we see the joke that he is, is Billy Eppler not nearly as good as we believe him to be?

We're all homers to an extent. But have we glossed over the failures of his teams he's built in the name of being Angel fans?

Sometimes when I brush my teeth too hard the enamored gets damaged.

[Second Base]

Sorry folks, new tablet. The autocorrect is just a little off.

[kevinb]

50 minutes ago, eligrba said:

What if the pitcher's stayed healthy?  I think we would have a different perspective if the Angels had healthy pitching the last couple of years.

 

What if’s are the best. 

[Inside Pitch]

2 hours ago, Second Base said:

Honest question for all of us Angel fans. Do remember how enameled we all were by Dipoto? Now we see the joke that he is, is Billy Eppler not nearly as good as we believe him to be?

We're all homers to an extent. But have we glossed over the failures of his teams he's built in the name of being Angel fans?

For me it's simple -- one guy came in talking up how he was this big time saber guy and how he was going to take that and apply it to his decision making then didn't other than some really terrible decisions where he seemingly was trying to outsmart the world.   The other came in downplaying his saber tendencies and then made them commonplace up and down the organization, creating systems where none existed.  Where Dipoto would say one thing they do the complete opposite, Eppler has been pretty true to his word.   When push comes to shove regardless of how it plays out from here, the general feeling both in house and around MLB is that the Angels are on the upswing as an organization even if the team hasn't played well. 

To me, that alone is a massive upgrade from the constant state of WTF and dysfunction we lived with for three years.  If his tenure ended this season after another losing season but the farm continued to develop as it has I will view him as the guy that got the Angels headed in the right direction again.  If he signs Trout to an extension, I'll consider him the guy that was able to save the franchise from the damage it brought upon itself.   I flip shit at JD but really, I'm just glad he's gone.  Anything he does to weaken a division rival from here on out can only be viewed as some of his best work for the Angels.

[Second Base]

4 hours ago, Inside Pitch said:

For me it's simple -- one guy came in talking up how he was this big time saber guy and how he was going to take that and apply it to his decision making then didn't other than some really terrible decisions where he seemingly was trying to outsmart the world.   The other came in downplaying his saber tendencies and then made them commonplace up and down the organization, creating systems where none existed.  Where Dipoto would say one thing they do the complete opposite, Eppler has been pretty true to his word.   When push comes to shove regardless of how it plays out from here, the general feeling both in house and around MLB is that the Angels are on the upswing as an organization even if the team hasn't played well. 

To me, that alone is a massive upgrade from the constant state of WTF and dysfunction we lived with for three years.  If his tenure ended this season after another losing season but the farm continued to develop as it has I will view him as the guy that got the Angels headed in the right direction again.  If he signs Trout to an extension, I'll consider him the guy that was able to save the franchise from the damage it brought upon itself.   I flip shit at JD but really, I'm just glad he's gone.  Anything he does to weaken a division rival from here on out can only be viewed as some of his best work for the Angels.

What I want to see, is the Angels competing every single year, always being a threat to win the division and the World Series. What I don't like to see, are teams that will sell off everything and tank so that they'll receive high draft picks, high bonus allotments, revenue sharing from the league and less stringent penalties for signing top free agents when they do decide to spend. I feel like that alienates the fans because they spend five years sucking so that they can compete for five more. 

You cant spend your way into constant contention, or rather you shouldn't. Even the Yankees don't spend their resources like that.

The only way you can compete year in and year out is to grow your superstars from within, and never trade them away for a rental if you can help it. It's great to have a Jean Segura, but trading six years of him at a discount rate for two months of Zack Greinke isn't a sustainable business model.

Now inevitably, some of those homegrown stars we develop will need to be retained and that will cost lots of money. So you spend it, but how do you offset those costs? Two ways. First, winning, because that results in parking, tickets, merchandise, consumables and fandom which means consistent returns to the stadium which means more money. And the second way to offset those costs is to have inexpensive yet valuable players at other positions. Instead of paying one RF 12 million a year for two wins above replacement, pay another one 500k a year for three wins above replacement. This sort of thing. 

So the only way this can happen is simply by hoarding prospects. Don't trade, just develop. 

That's what Billy has done so far. Sure, he's traded a prospect here and there. None that he had a hand in signing, but he has traded them. But he's recouped the cost pretty much every time. He traded for Simmons, and now has one of the best shortstops in baseball on a team friendly contract. He traded for Upton, which gave him a taste of what it's like to be play here, which led  to an extension, instead of free agent bidding. He traded two halfway decent prospects for Kinsler, and traded Kinsler for two other halfway decent prospects. 

So I like Eppler. My hope is that he continues to fight the urge to trade his prospects for big leaguers with big contracts. Many GM's have set out to build a consistent winner, but very few held onto the job long enough to see that happen, or rather very few held out long enough to see it happen. Most end up trading the prospects for veterans. 

This obviously doesn't mean they need to be the Rays or the A's, relying solely on prospects and scraps. But somewhere in between. A team that relies on prospects, but has the money to keep them and bring in others. As far as I can tell, three teams do it better than anyone, the Cardinals, Astros and Red Sox. The Astros got there by tanking, and the Red Sox by spending mostly. So I guess just the Cardinals. 

[Taylor]

7 hours ago, Second Base said:

Do remember how enameled we all were by Dipoto?

Dipoto did feel like a fresh coat of paint at the time.

[GA16]

10 hours ago, Second Base said:

Honest question for all of us Angel fans. Do remember how enameled we all were by Dipoto? Now we see the joke that he is, is Billy Eppler not nearly as good as we believe him to be?

We're all homers to an extent. But have we glossed over the failures of his teams he's built in the name of being Angel fans?

I think that much of the hate Dipoto gets from Angels fans now is partially attributed to the way he left the organization in the middle of the season. Compounded by the many poor decisions he made during his tenure; Baldoquin, Clevinger, Hamilton, Wilson etc...He was also a very charismatic guy, so when he showed his true colors it made it that much worse. 

Under Eppler, the long term health of the team is looking astronomically better than it was under Dipoto. Granted the current state hasn't been what we all have hopped for. However, I think when grading Eppler's current performance, the numerous pitching injuries sustained in the last 3 years need to be considered. The team most likely would have still missed the playoffs 2 of the 3 years that Eppler has been here, but we had a pretty decent chance of making the WC in 2017 had it not been for all the SP injuries and Trout's thumb injury. It has also been said that Eppler "made Ohtani happen" and that he "crushed the presentation". It is quite possible that Ohtani would have landed somewhere else had Dipoto presented for us. The fact only, that he was instrumental in acquiring Ohtani is a huge vote of confidence that we have the right guy in charge.

So while I think there is a bit of homerism in the love for Eppler, it seems clear that he has done a remarkable job and I think the true fruits of his efforts will be realized in the years to come. 

[Lou]

^^^ well said, NO 

[IEAngelsfan]

17 hours ago, Taylor said:

Dipoto did feel like a fresh coat of paint at the time.

Only to find out later that he turned out to be a polished turd.

[notherhalo]

Will the Mariners still finish above us in 2019?

[Ace-Of-Diamonds]

no

[T.G.]

Homer Simpson could have replaced Reagins and we'd have all been just as enamored.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

On 11/24/2018 at 5:31 PM, halomatt said:

I was pretty lacquered up! 

Rust-Oleum.

[Tank]

12 hours ago, True Grich said:

Homer Simpson could have replaced Reagins and we'd have all been just as enamored.

 

[T.G.]

The Mariners staff had a party after their latest round of moves...