Thoughts on Pujols future...

[Adam]

He stinks. At least he's hitting 5th now. 

[Torridd]

43 minutes ago, floplag said:

Yeah, i would agree with this and what others have said.  Make next year the farewell tour and lower his playing time.  I think the latter is a given at this point as Thaiss or JMF are pressuring him and need a chance to show what they can do at some point. 

Are they pressuring him? I know JMF was a major leaguer so his time may have passed, but what about Thaiss? Is he really ready to make the jump?

[Torridd]

44 minutes ago, jordan said:

It’s interesting with Ohtani as DH.  Pujols has to see that it’s Ohtani’s time, and he needs to be in the lineup a majority of the time.  Pujols can still play 1B and he’s done remarkably well this year.  But this also adds to the wear and tear on his body and he probably can’t spend as much time there next season, and beyond.   But the whole Ohtani and Tommy John could play a big role on how quickly Pujols decides to retire.  If Ohtani can avoid TJ and be primary DH, Pujols can probably only put a decreasing amount of time in the field going into next season.   But if Ohtani has TJ, it opens up the DH spot for all of next season more than likely.  Will be very interesting how it all plays out.  

Good point. I don't think Pujols would stand in anyone's way if there was a player that could replace him in the lineup. If Ohtani grabs the DH, Pujols still has 1B unless Thaiss is that good.

[floplag]

8 minutes ago, BackUpTheTruck said:

I don't think Pujols should be gauranteed a starting role next year, he should have to compete with Thaiss.  If Thaiss struggles with lefties, perhaps there can be a platoon.  I am assuming Ohtani is DH full time next year.

When Ohtani is pitching again, Thaiss could start every night at first base, and Pujols could share DH with Ohtani.

If this was some random player i would completely agree, but its not, thus it isnt that simple. 
For starters hes a first ballot hall of famer, but that isnt even the most critical part as hes also been Trouts largest mentor.  
If you simply dismiss this man, it will not sit well with Trout.  It has to be handled the right way. 

[BackUpTheTruck]

Just checked Thaiss' minor league 2018 splits. He does hit RHP much better than LHP.

[CanadianHalo]

The Angels travel to St.Louis next season so he’s for sure going to want to play there again. 

He’s also going to want to collect every dollar of that contract so unless the Angels agree to pay him he isn’t going to retire. 

The best move for the Angels would be to agree to pay him and ask him to take on a bench role of some sorts. This team will not contend as long as he is still playing.

[failos]

I wish he’d juice

[floplag]

Just now, CanadianHalo said:

The Angels travel to St.Louis next season so he’s for sure going to want to play there again. 

He’s also going to want to collect every dollar of that contract so unless the Angels agree to pay him he isn’t going to retire. 

The best move for the Angels would be to agree to pay him and ask him to take on a bench role of some sorts. This team will not contend as long as he is still playing.

i think he could be an excellent, albeit over payed, hitting coach myself. 
I dont agree that we cant contend though, we can, it would just cost that much more.

[T.G.]

2 minutes ago, failos said:

I wish he’d juice

Be careful what you wish for.

[Torridd]

6 minutes ago, BackUpTheTruck said:

Just checked Thaiss' minor league 2018 splits. He does hit RHP much better than LHP.

What are his entire stats, Truck? 

[BackUpTheTruck]

2 minutes ago, Torridd said:

What are his entire stats, Truck? 

RHP: 251 AB, .299/.354/.554/.908

LHP: 84 AB, .238/.286/.357/.643

178 AAA at bats, 157 AA at bats.

[BackUpTheTruck]

22 minutes ago, BackUpTheTruck said:

RHP: 251 AB, .299/.354/.554/.908

LHP: 84 AB, .238/.286/.357/.643

178 AAA at bats, 157 AA at bats.

Good news, Taylor Ward is batting .359 against RHP, and .359 vs. LHP this year in AA/AAA. With 2 outs RISP he is batting .370/.517/.696/1.212.

[Torridd]

26 minutes ago, BackUpTheTruck said:

RHP: 251 AB, .299/.354/.554/.908

LHP: 84 AB, .238/.286/.357/.643

178 AAA at bats, 157 AA at bats.

Truck, do you think he's ready to take over for Pujols?

[mulwin444]

Pujols is in the HOF regardless of his performance the next 3 seasons so he has $87 million reasons to keep playing.  Maybe an equitable buyout might work but I just don't see him accepting a reduced role 

[Angel Oracle]

41 minutes ago, True Grich said:

Be careful what you wish for.

Judging by this season, he hasn't drank much of that juice himself.

[ten ocho recon scout]

Ill post something more enlightened later. But just as far as a financial standpoint, if there is any truth to WAR and dollar values, does it make sense to replace pujols with ohtani or someone else? Meaning, do the supposed added wins vs pujols' negatives make sense from a sabre money standpoint?

I know its easier said than done eating 60 million...but if you arent getting your moneys worth anyway...

[Griffey's Corner]

I think this year or next will be Pujols last season. Most likely the Angels will still pay him all or most of the money owed. Maybe they work it into his services contract or maybe an injury settlement?

 

 

[BackUpTheTruck]

1 hour ago, Torridd said:

Truck, do you think he's ready to take over for Pujols?

I haven't seen enough. So no.

[Tyler]

Please Retire... if not buy him out and goodbye. Too much negative weight for this offense. Can't even run anymore.

[ten ocho recon scout]

Im sure he'll be back next year. But i assume he'll be a bench guy. I really dont see how they can continue to start him.

Ohtani cant pitch next year anyway (from what we know). So he moves to the full time DH spot. Pujols i doubt can hack playing 1B for a full season.

I think it all comes down to comfort. IE, if hes not playing, someone at his spot is outproducing (so theres no argument that hes been replaced), he'll finally have to accept reality.

If he doesnt, fine. Is what it is, we signed a bad contract. Still dont need to start him.

[fan_since79]

As he continues to decline yet stubbornly continues to play, and then finishes with a batting average of .299 or lower, I hope it gnaws at him for years that he didn't quit when he should have.

 

 

[ksangel]

2 hours ago, mulwin444 said:

Pujols is in the HOF regardless of his performance the next 3 seasons so he has $87 million reasons to keep playing.  Maybe an equitable buyout might work but I just don't see him accepting a reduced role 

Pujols has a guaranteed contract and will be paid the full amount unless he quits, his contract is voided per MLB rules or is he permanently injured. 

Buying Pujols out would help with what Artie spends each year but it wouldn't help the team with regard to AAV and the Luxury Tax. 

AAV for luxury tax is determined by players original contract amount (total $'s) divided by years of contract.  It doesn't matter if the player is released, like Henley Ramirez, the AAV counts each year the player is or would have been under contract.

Getting Pujols off the roster is a media issue.  How the Angels do it to avoid looking bad is the issue.  I'd bet Artie doesn't want the media attention from cutting a first ballot HOF'er. 

[mulwin444]

18 minutes ago, ksangel said:

Pujols has a guaranteed contract and will be paid the full amount unless he quits, his contract is voided per MLB rules or is he permanently injured. 

Buying Pujols out would help with what Artie spends each year but it wouldn't help the team with regard to AAV and the Luxury Tax. 

AAV for luxury tax is determined by players original contract amount (total $'s) divided by years of contract.  It doesn't matter if the player is released, like Henley Ramirez, the AAV counts each year the player is or would have been under contract.

Getting Pujols off the roster is a media issue.  How the Angels do it to avoid looking bad is the issue.  I'd bet Artie doesn't want the media attention from cutting a first ballot HOF'er. 

Yeah, I know about the AAV...I'm just talking about buying him out to get him off the roster so someone who is good at running, hitting and fielding can take his place.  We're on the hook regardless but we can at least find someone who can post more than 0.5 WAR a season to take those at bats.

[Angelsjunky]

First of all, Pujols is not much better this year. He's the same - no decline, no improvement. 

2017: .241/.286/.386, 78 wRC+, -1.9 fWAR

2018: .245/.285/.403, 89 wRC+, -0.3 fWAR

Okay, he's fractionally better - a bit more power, but that is also just fluctuation as he recently hit a couple HR. His WAR is slightly better due to less of a DH penalty, but overall he's pretty much the same player, which is...

Not just below average, but below replacement level. Think about that: he's worse than Paul McAnulty or Robb Quinlan.

Secondly, it is nice to honor the man, but this whole "he's a great guy" thing has another side. I've heard that he's a bit of an asshole. But who cares, really? On-field performance is what matters, so any decision should be based primarily on that.

There is another aspect of this, though,. Albert Pujols is possibly the most disappointing Angels player in my time as an Angels fan, going back to the early 80s, in terms of how good he actually was compared to how I hoped he would be (Casey Kotchman and Brandon Wood are close, though). The Wells trade and Hamilton contract both seemed bad at the time they happened, but I still shudder at the memory of the "We Got Pujols" moment - how exciting it was, and how it all turned out.

So for me he couldn't retire soon enough. I know it is my bias based upon the disappointing, but I do think that we have better options who can out-perform him right now in Matt Thaiss and Jose Miguel Fernandez and, soon enough, Jared Walsh. 

Because I'm basically optimistic by nature, I think this is Pujols' last year as a regular. Next year he'll probably start as a platoon with Thaiss/Fernandez/Ohtani at DH/1B, and gradually be weened off playing time. If he sticks around after that, who knows. 

[Blarg]

For the Angels to succeed Pujols needs to step away. He just isn't a MLB quality player. There is no dead car bounce season where he is, for one last brief moment, the superstar he was. 

Whether he's ready to accept that or not, it will be Eppler's job to make that decision for him. I have to believe a buyout will part of this offseason along with a coaching change. I think 2019 will be a clean slate start with players they have a longer term commitment to and the last of the Dipoto era will be gone.