Angels' Cron shows range

[Angel Oracle]

He's like that MLB player that has to go to the AS Game because every team has to have at least one player.

That's how BAAAAAD this farm system currently is.

[rc4halos]

Our farm system is not very deep but Cron deserves to go to the Futures game. He is hitting close to .300 and last year he led all MILB in RBI. Thats not bad no matter how weak the overall system.

[Angel Oracle]

Grichuk does have a higher OPS than Cron currently (.792 vs. .779).

Grichuk has improved a lot from 2 years ago, and is on pace for just 100 Ks (not horrible).   

To me, he should be within the top 2-3 prospects in the system.  

[Scott34]

Grichuk does have a higher OPS than Cron currently (.792 vs. .779).

Grichuk has improved a lot from 2 years ago, and is on pace for just 100 Ks (not horrible).   

To me, he should be within the top 2-3 prospects in the system.  

 

Shhhh our top 50 midseason is coming out soon.

[Tyler]

Better give some love to Toribio.

[Tyler]

2 HR, 13 RBI and 2:5 BB:SO in last 10 games.

[Second Base]

Oddly enough, we have Kramer Sneed ranked identically. 

[rc4halos]

For whatever reason, Cron, IMHO, is under appreciated by many on this board. He is a run producer. Since turning pro he has 215 RBI in 240 games. That is pretty good. Granted, he hasn't shown the consistent power we might like to see or maybe drawn the number of walks, but he has driven in a bunch of runs and that is what you want from a MOTO bat. It should be interesting to see if his power starts developing this year and next.

[Second Base]

Again, I think most fans have really lost sight of one thing, the power ISN'T developing, it's ALREADY THERE.  Remember before the season when I reminded everyone that the Texas League and specifically Dickey Stephens Park are notorious for keeping HR in the yard and that Cron's HR totals will suffer s a result and so will fans' confidence in his abilities?  

 

See?  It's happening.  I mean nevermind the fact that Cron is leading the Travs in doubles by a wide margin and is batting .290 in his first stint in AA while the rest of us get excited over Lindsey hitting .270 and Grichuk hitting .250.  He's probably going to hit around 20 HR this season in AA.  How many did Mark Trumbo hit in AA?  15.  How many did he go on to hit in AAA?  36.  How many did he go on to hit in the Majors?  30+.  How many did Mike Trout hit in AA?  11.  How many did he go on to hit in the Majors?  30. 

 

I mean the fact that Cron is being dropped so far on prospect lists and fans are losing perspective on what kind of hitter the Angels have on their hands is actually comical.  Are we all going to anoint him the top prospect next year when he bats .300 and hits over 30 HR in the HR environment Salt Lake?  Probably not, everyone will call into question the numbers because of the environment.  So then why are we down on him when he only hits 20ish HR in the exact opposite environment in AA?  Should we not all call into question how this environment is effecting his game in the same manner it did other hitters with power?  

[jsnpritchett]

He has 7 HR in more than half of a season.  What makes you think he's going to hit "around 20" this season?

[Angel Oracle]

Shhhh our top 50 midseason is coming out soon.

I promise I didn't peak on Grichuk being ranked 2nd on that list.       

[Second Base]

Around 20 could be anywhere 16-23.  He has 2 HR in his last two games, has tremendous physical strength and the temperatures are beginning to climb, which means the ball will be flying further in the summertime than it did in April and May.

 

And even then it doesn't change my argument that fans have lost perspective and are looking into power numbers without actual scouting.  I mean if you want to quote the lack of walks, at least you'd have a leg to stand on if you don't believe Cron is very good, and even then it's flimsy.  But to be down on him as a result of his HR totals this year without looking at how he's performed against LHP & RHP, home & away, month to month, batting average and doubles, you'd be leaving yourself completely exposed.  

 

It just isn't a good or valid perspective at all. 

[Angel Oracle]

I still see some Billy Butler comps in Cron.

Although Butler has shown solid plate discipline since 2009 (average of over 60 BBs/season). 

[Scott34]

From what I understand, Cron is getting the title of BP legend.  Has amazing batting practice rounds, practices, springs, but when push comes to shove, he becomes aggressive and loses a lot of his power by chasing pitches. 

 

The talent is there.  I just struggle to see the value in a 23-year-old DH with a sub .800 OPS in Double-A.

 

It's the same argument with Trumbo.  Trumbo is a solid player but not a star and not a great player.  People get caught up in the light-tower power.

 

I hope I'm wrong on this, but I don't think Cron becomes anything MORE than Trumbo.

[Tyler]

And he won't. But that's not a bad thing either.

[Second Base]

Precisely Shane, and I think that's where the perspective differs.  I think Cron will be a .280 or .290 hitter that hits 25-35 HR's a year.  He's no superstar, especially at the position he plays, but he's solid.  Trumbo is what he is, .270 and 30-40 HR's.  Not a superstar, again because of the position he plays, but solid.  

 

So C.J. Cron is going to an a solid Major League 1B.  I mean what's wrong with .285 and 30 HR?

[Inside Pitch]

Precisely Shane, and I think that's where the perspective differs.  I think Cron will be a .280 or .290 hitter that hits 25-35 HR's a year.  He's no superstar, especially at the position he plays, but he's solid.  Trumbo is what he is, .270 and 30-40 HR's.  Not a superstar, again because of the position he plays, but solid.  

 

So C.J. Cron is going to an a solid Major League 1B.  I mean what's wrong with .285 and 30 HR?

 

 

Predicting 30 HRs in today's MLB is a saying a bit more than he's going to be  "solid ML 1B." but I may be guilty of arguing semantics..   I see the connection you're making with Trumbo, but I'm not seeing that sort of game-changing power.  I will say this much, the bat speed is likely better than Trumbo's.

 

But as far as power goes... there were all of 15 people who hit 30 HRs last year, looking at the leaderboards this year, it's likely we see 15-20 again this year..   When I look at Cron, I don't see a guy who will be among the top 20 HR threats in MLB, which is where a 30 HR guy would fall now.   

 

I firmly believe his park is hurting his HR totals, I also genuinely believe he COULD hit for better power than he's shown, but he needs to start showing the ability to turn on a pitch and drive it over a wall.  Grichuk is doing that at age 21, in that very same park.  Cron isn't.   There is nothing he does as a hitter that would make you doubt that he COULD turn on a pitch, or create loft -- it's just not yet happening.  Why it's not happening, whether it's a byproduct of his current approach or whatever is up for debate..    His current line in AA somewhat resembles a post Wally World, Wally Joyner.     Joyner, Billy Butler..  That may very well be where he falls.

 

I will say this much...   That same swing and set of mechanics will likely manifest itself as a 30+ HR season in Salt Lake, unfortunately, Angel Stadium plays noting like SLC.   Of course, it's just as easy to argue that the park in Arkansas doesn't really play like the Big A either.

[Second Base]

I like that you bring up SLC!  Because I think one could make a valid argument that would say Cron's numbers in Anaheim would likely fall somewhere between his numbers in Arkansas and SLC.  I just wonder how high folks will be on Cron a year from now when he's on pace for an over .300 batting average and over 30 HR's because of the altitude.  How many will pat themselves on the back for coming to the conclusion that Cron's made some sort of adjustment and rank him higher than they are this year just because of the hitting environment?

 

I'm just not sure I see the difference between .290 and 20 HR in Arkansas and .300 and 30 HR in SLC. 

[jsnpritchett]

Let's see if he hits .290 with 20 HR at Arkansas first...

[jshep]

For whatever reason, Cron, IMHO, is under appreciated by many on this board. He is a run producer. Since turning pro he has 215 RBI in 240 games. That is pretty good. Granted, he hasn't shown the consistent power we might like to see or maybe drawn the number of walks, but he has driven in a bunch of runs and that is what you want from a MOTO bat. It should be interesting to see if his power starts developing this year and next.

Hes being "underappreciated" because his 215 RBI in 240 games since turning pro isn't a good way of judging his talent at all.

I really don't care how many runs he drives in in A or AA or AAA when his skillset is still lacking. I'll start looking at him as a future middle of the order bat when he's not hacking away at levels worse than Jeff Francouer or Yuniesky Betancourt. Or when he's showing all this tremendous power he's supposed to have more consistently in actual games.

Because until those things start happening, , IMO, he looks more like a guy you bat 6th or 7th and cross your fingers he avoids making too many outs and taps into some of that power to stick in the lineup. All while playing average defense at best at the least demanding defensive position, or being a DH. And that's if he sticks as a regular.

I appreciate the optimistic approach to our prospects(and as down as I sound on Cron now, the fact that he has that power somewhere in there and has shown plate discipline in the past makes me at least slightly more optimistic than a guy that never had), but the fact that he'll have all sorts of minor league RBI totals to tell his kids and grand kids about doesn't make me feel any better about the fact that the "advanced college bat" the Angels thought was one of the 20 best players in the country and who is going to have to hit A LOT going forward has taken a pretty noticeable step backwards offensively.

[Second Base]

Noticeable step backward offensively?  Who has the highest BA on the team?  Most doubles?  Most RBI's?  Most XBH?  Highest OBP?  On top of which, of all our prospects on that team, which is the one who needed no adjustment period and just kept producing all in his first year seeing advanced pitching?

 

Every team Cron has played on, he's been the best hitter.  I mean that's great everyone all on Lindsey and Grichuk's jock's right now because they're both flashing power, but such attention shouldn't come at the price of Cron, who is still the best hitter in the system.  Tools, contact ability, physical projection, with the exception of Kole Calhoun, C.J. Cron is the safest bet in the Angels system to be a Major Leaguer, every other prospect will have adjustments to make. 

[Inside Pitch]

Noticeable step backward offensively?  Who has the highest BA on the team?  Most doubles?  Most RBI's?  Most XBH?  Highest OBP?  On top of which, of all our prospects on that team, which is the one who needed no adjustment period and just kept producing all in his first year seeing advanced pitching?

 

Every team Cron has played on, he's been the best hitter.  I mean that's great everyone all on Lindsey and Grichuk's jock's right now because they're both flashing power, but such attention shouldn't come at the price of Cron, who is still the best hitter in the system.  Tools, contact ability, physical projection, with the exception of Kole Calhoun, C.J. Cron is the safest bet in the Angels system to be a Major Leaguer, every other prospect will have adjustments to make. 

 

 

You're overselling here.  

 

I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm less impressed with the power being shown than I am Grichuk and Lindsey doing well as 21 year olds in a league were the optimal age this season appears to be 23.  That is likely to come down some as guys get promoted before August 15th but as of right now, they have a huge jump on the league when you consider their ages..  Grichuk always had plus power, guy was launching moonshots in HS, so really...  That's not new.

 

Cron's age needs to be taken into consideration when talking about adjustments periods and tools/body wise, Randal Grichuk is still more projectable than Cron -- let's be honest he can actually run and his glove isn't just for decoration.  Sure there are things he needs to work on before he's as sure a thing as Cron, but RG is an impressive albeit still raw talent.

 

RG at age 21 in AA is a massively more intriguing player to me than is the 23 year old college player, Cron.  That fact that so many have written him off for not being Mike Trout only adds to story IMO.

[Angel Oracle]

I'm refraining from judging a AA player based on HR numbers. 

Wood put up 29 HRs at Arkansas at age 21, and we all know how that turned out eventually.

[Inside Pitch]

I appreciate the optimistic approach to our prospects(and as down as I sound on Cron now, the fact that he has that power somewhere in there and has shown plate discipline in the past makes me at least slightly more optimistic than a guy that never had), but the fact that he'll have all sorts of minor league RBI totals to tell his kids and grand kids about doesn't make me feel any better about the fact that the "advanced college bat" the Angels thought was one of the 20 best players in the country and who is going to have to hit A LOT going forward has taken a pretty noticeable step backwards offensively.

 

I think you and I see Cron similarly.  My big concern with Cron stems from a couple scouts in the Red Sox  and Mariner's systems that both feel he was overrated coming out of college and was the prototypical "Player's son", which they explained as simply being a kid who was ahead of the curve due to full time coaching.  Much of what he was billed as being hasn't really materialized so it's a bit worrisome -- what if 21 year old CJ Cron was as good as he was going to get?  I'm not saying I think that, but it's something that is in the back of my head at times.  Anyway, I do believe he's got more power than he's shown, and I like his hands as a hitter, more than it likely seems from the thing's I've posted..  That's the one area where I may come close to matching Scott's enthusiasm for Cron... his contact rate.  It's not really common to see a guy who looks to be able to generate the kind of power Cron is potentially capable of who also move his hands the way he does

 

I just wish he was creating a bit more loft and showing the ability to pull.  I'll stop short of saying he can't pull the ball because I haven't seen evidence that, at times it seems he's purposely going with pitches and that his approach seems to be to spray the ball to all fields.  Again, he's not yet shown it, but he's got the makings of being a lot more than he's shown to date power wise.  

 

To be perfectly frank, Cron is precisely the sort of hitter I would love to see Chili Davis work with.  I think under a guy like Davis you would see Cron attacking balls on the inside part of the plate and the power numbers would come.  Bobby Grich too.  I'd love to see Grich working with some of our minor league guys.

[Inside Pitch]

I'm refraining from judging a AA player based on HR numbers. 

Wood put up 29 HRs at Arkansas at age 21, and we all know how that turned out eventually.

 

 

I feel bad for Wood...  I think his problem was between the ears,