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What if Ohtani completely rakes in ST?


Chuck

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I'm not trying to get ahead of myself here, but just asking the question. Does Scioscia and management still only give him 3 games a week at the plate if he rakes during ST?

I heard they may not pencil him in the lineup on the day before, the day of (obviously, unless against the NL in their parks) and the day after. 

I can totally see a #FreeOhtani thread in the future if he proves he can hit Major League pitching well. You know Sosh and gang may be really conservative with him since Mike is traditionally a conservative type manager (hitting platoons, lefty/righty bullpen matchup's, 100 IP, pulled, etc.).

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I'm just guessing here, but I'm thinking they will give him his regularly scheduled DH ABs, and stick as close to his schedule in Japan as possible for Year One. Everyone recognizes his pitching ability is the big focus and value, and they'll prioritize his growth and time there at first, while letting him pick up the bat as a DH/PH as often as allows. 

Over the course of the season, and his career, I think we'll see him start working in the field in RF/LF and 1B - maybe as a late-inning PH/defensive replacement here or there - but only if his pitching is at an appropriate level. They'll let his bat develop incrementally and let him work the effort into his schedule as allows. I think both parties recognize the risk and will play it safe. 

If he really is a true two-way player, and he can handle it, you could see him becoming someone who plays both ways more full-time in three or four years, which would be purely astounding. The Angels were willing to give him that opportunity.

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It really depends on his pitching.  If he is an ace then he won’t DH as often as fans would like even if he rakes.  Then we will have the narrative that we would have won this game or that game if “only the fat man would have started Ohtani at DH”.  Unless he is a legit bat, we are talking someone as good as Upton, then there is no upside to risking his health, because his real value will come as a legitimate shut down starter.  

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I'm sure they'll bring him along slowly and stick with the plan.  If he comes out blasting a 950+ OPS, then yeah, perhaps he forces his way into the lineup on an almost daily basis.  But that said, I am sure they have a developmental plan with him and will bring him along slowly.  His value to us almost assuredly will be his pitching, so they are going to prioritize the preservation of his arm over the utilization of his bat, I imagine.

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It depends on what is more valuable to the team. If he's an MVP caliber bat and a medium to good pitcher, then that's changes things and maybe he's in there every day and also pitching out of the pen? If he's a Cy young caliber starter and a bat like say Kole Calhoun or Howie Kendrick for instance, then his future is on the mound.

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I read that apparently in Japan pitchers did not go inside on him.  Apparently a respect thing since he’s trying to do both and also because no one wanted to be the guy that hit him in the elbow and fucked him up.  

As far as hitting goes.  I want to see how he handles being pitched inside.  Don’t get me wrong.  I’m very excited about getting Ohtani and expect that we got a top of the rotation pitcher.  But I’m a lot more tempered in my enthusiasm for the hitting part of it.  Hoping for the best of course.  We all know how incredible it would be if he’s a legit good power hitter as well as pitcher.

Anyway, I want to see that before I start thinking about possibilities of him raking. 

Edited by UndertheHalo
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2 hours ago, Stradling said:

It really depends on his pitching.  If he is an ace then he won’t DH as often as fans would like even if he rakes.  

I dunno man, if he rakes then there's very little reason to keep him out of the lineup on rest days.

Of course, this is just me imagining a true Babe Ruth scenario of dominating on the mound and at the plate. 

Which I'm totally sure is going to happen, right guys? 

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14 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

I read that apparently in Japan pitchers did not go inside on him.  Apparently a respect thing since he’s trying to do both and also because no one wanted to be the guy that hit him in the elbow and fucked him up.  

Where'd you read that? 

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If Ohtani does rake, then eventually, and probably sooner rather than later, you are going to have to decide how to deal with Pujols....In the excitement of the signing, we've conveniently forgotten that we have a 38 year old dead weight DH who probably isn't a good bet to play much 1b again....we'll see....

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10 minutes ago, laagamer said:

Where'd you read that? 

https://www.baseballamerica.com/majors/ex-big-leaguers-japan-ohtani-special-not-invincible-talent/#FFxEQJAl5EiUuRAI.97

"Sarfate, for example, has been able to keep Ohtani in check over the five seasons he's faced him.

"I think I faced him 11 times and I think I gave up a single and triple, and the single was actually a squiggler down the third-base line that he beat out." Sarfate said. "He's got decent plate awareness, the only problem I see him having issues with early on—and he can make the adjustment—is fastballs in. Japanese guys tend to stay away from him, I think it's a lot of respect and they don't want to throw a fastball in and break his arm or hit him in the elbow. I think he's aware of that, that no one pitches him in. I pitch him in and have had good success going in.

"Big league pitchers aren't afraid to go in, they don't care who you are. And that's going to be his one adjustment he's going to have to make."

Morel, from his vantage point playing the infield, sees the same potential shortcoming on fastballs in.

"He just has unbelievable pop to the opposite field, center field (but) it didn't seem like he pulled too many balls unless they were offspeed," Morel said. "I think he'll get pounded in like any young hitter going to the big leagues. He'll have to make the adjustment. He was so big and strong he didn't have to worry about it too much over there. I'm not saying he can't make the adjustment, he just hasn't had to yet."


 

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I imagine if he has great success, he will max out at as many at bats as he feels like he can do while staying healthy - that will still mean taking plenty of games off, probably. If he has minimal success, he will slowly (SLOWLY) weaned off of hitting. That's all assuming his pitching is as advertised. If not, its anyone's guess.

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3 minutes ago, calscuf said:

I think everyone should temper their expectations.  I'm hoping for the best, but it would suck if people got down on him because he's not a superstar immediately.

Agreed. (And kudos for saying it woupd suck if people got down).

Everyone needs to keep in mind, the whole excitement of him playing 2 ways also means theres two elements he can bomb at. Hes goung to have fo adjust to major league hitters as well as pitchers. And as far as batting, hes not even doing it full time...think about how much more time he'll have to split to work on both crafts...

To me, im not even really thinking about his bat...i think that will be shorter lived than we think. But his pitching skills should be a welcome boost. The reports ive read sound pretty exciting.

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17 minutes ago, Gil said:

https://www.baseballamerica.com/majors/ex-big-leaguers-japan-ohtani-special-not-invincible-talent/#FFxEQJAl5EiUuRAI.97

"Sarfate, for example, has been able to keep Ohtani in check over the five seasons he's faced him.

23 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I read this as well.  

Super interesting. I also noticed what looked like some control problems. Many of his K's were balls that were belt high or above. Stuff he wouldn't get away with too often over here.

 

And hitting is seriously skeptical. Very interesting read. 
 

 

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Its honestly sooo hard to tell. Its possible Ohtani was only successful in Japan because of Japanese league specific factors, but its also possible that he took advantage of what he found, and he will continue to adjust and take advantage of whatever he finds here. If a guy is raking in the minors, its possible that its only because no one can throw a half decent off-speed pitch or whatever, but its also possible that he just mashes. Grain of salt, for sure, but I'm still cautiously optimistic here.

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I hope Shohei Ohtahi rakes for two reasons.   One of course is to make the team successful.   The other is to stick it to stupid Skankee fans like Nick DiBenedetto on FB who say Ohtani will totally wash out.   You just know that if he went to the Skankees, DiBenedetto would be fawning all over him like he was the second coming of Babe Ruth. 

Anyway, any pitcher who sits at mid/upper 90s and has a solid splitter and solid slider is no ordinary pitcher, especially if they are drawing Verlander comparisons.

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7 hours ago, HaloNArizona said:

Depending on off days and going off of what he did in Japan...even if he is totally off the charts n ST, I dont see him getting more AB's.  I think he doesnt hit before or after his starts.  Unless it's a pinch hit opportunity.

This!

There is so much preparation that goes into a Start and he's going to be dealing with interpreters and all, media shit storm, too much going on....And then afterwards the first day afterwards he wont touch the field maybe an at bat as a pinch hitter.

3-4 days a week is a good amount with maybe a ph spot sprinkled in.

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Babe Ruth  pitched in 30 games three times (1915 - 1917).  He maxed out at 152 plate appearances in those years.

1918 and 1919 were the only years he did both quite a bit.   

1918: 95 G / 352 PA and  20 G/166 IP   

1919: 130 G / 543 PA and 17 G / 133 IP.

 

It seems we will see something similar to Ruth's 1918 if Ohtani's bat warrants that many plate appearances.. 

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Another benefit of Ohtani: even though he'll only start 60ish games at DH, he makes one hell of a pinch hitter to have on the 75ish games he doesn't pitch or DH.

2 minutes ago, WeatherWonk said:

I'm not trying to get ahead of myself, either, but I just realized that IF Ohtani blew out his arm and needed TJ,  we would lose a starting pitcher and 50-60% of our DH. Bit of a two-edged sword.

katanas are one-edged.

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3 minutes ago, Throwman91 said:

The thing is, he has an astounding bat and swing and his size means he won't have to exert so much force to hit home runs (he's a monster), the other good news is his pitching affects the opposite oblique muscles because he's lefty/righty so the strain shouldn't be much more than your average hitting pitcher in the NL deals with when they hit/pitch.  He has an incredible opportunity to be the best of both worlds and have his cake and eat it.

Only if he makes the cut, but he's going to have to paddle his own canoe. I'll go out on a limb and say the world is his oyster.

(Idiomatic proverbs)

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10 hours ago, HaloNArizona said:

Depending on off days and going off of what he did in Japan...even if he is totally off the charts n ST, I dont see him getting more AB's.  I think he doesnt hit before or after his starts.  Unless it's a pinch hit opportunity.

Jeff FletcherVerified account @JeffFletcherOCR 10h10 hours ago

Just fiddled around with this for an interview with a Japanese television reporter. DQySbCuWkAAAG2o.jpg

4 replies 11 retweets 48 likes
 
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