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Marlins Hope To Trade Stanton, Gordon, Prado


Mark68

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3 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Didn’t I read that Urias career is in danger because of some crazy injury?  

Yes. He's out for a year plus because of some arm injury I think. But should he come back, any of him, Buehler, or their other prospect whose name escapes me right now could also need some $$$. Alvarez maybe?

Point is, Stanton would certainly bring some more offense but they already have quite a bit, have no problem buying more if needed, and have a young team that will get expensive at some point. Not sure they need Stanton's contract with all that factored in.

I think they're going to go all in on both Darvish and Otani.

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Just now, Stradling said:

I could be wrong but I think Otani’s contract is decided by international pool money, plus the $20 million posting fee.  In other words every single team can afford him as long as they have pool money.  I guess my point is Otani probably doesn’t prevent any team from acquiring big dollar players.  At least that is my understanding. 

True but Otani’s initial MLB contract will only be a short term deal. The team that signs him will have to plan ahead to extend him to a mega deal if he warrants it on the field. 

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I think the Cardinals are one to watch too. They're going to be hungry to chase down the Cubs, have payroll to play with, and have young outfielders and pitching to dangle back at Miami as well. They could make a play for any of Stanton, Yelich, or Ozuna and also take on a bad contract while still offering prospects or a Piscotty/Grichuk back.

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2 minutes ago, Calzone said:

True but Otani’s initial MLB contract will only be a short term deal. The team that signs him will have to plan ahead to extend him to a mega deal if he warrants it on the field. 

Yea but I think it’s one of those putting the cart before the horse type things.  Whichever team he decides to go to, since he’s essentially a free agent, there’s at the very least a desire to play for that team or in that part of the country.  The difference between going to the highest bidder and the average bidder is what, $3 million total?  

When you look at Japanese players, even if he’s the best Japanese power hitter we’ve seen and he’s the best Japanese pitcher we’ve seen, he’d be Darvish/Matsui.  I find it very hard to believe he will be the best in both.  That’s a very nice player, but not someone you make personnel decision now in hope you keep that player later. Now if someone told me he is Ichiro with power I’d be all in today to keep him tomorrow.  

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4 minutes ago, totdprods said:

I think the Cardinals are one to watch too. They're going to be hungry to chase down the Cubs, have payroll to play with, and have young outfielders and pitching to dangle back at Miami as well. They could make a play for any of Stanton, Yelich, or Ozuna and also take on a bad contract while still offering prospects or a Piscotty/Grichuk back.

This is one of those times where Claude is right in his, the player with a no trade clause has all the power. Where Stanton wants to play geographically is going to play a huge roll in where he ends up.  Especially when he has 10 years left on his deal.  

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11 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I could be wrong but I think Otani’s contract is decided by international pool money, plus the $20 million posting fee.  In other words every single team can afford him as long as they have pool money.  I guess my point is Otani probably doesn’t prevent any team from acquiring big dollar players.  At least that is my understanding. 

You are correct -- anyone who can pony up the 20 mil gets to talk to him then teams have to work within the current international system.    The Yankees only edge is being the Yankees.  If he wants to play there then he will end up taking whatever it is they can offer because the rules have been altered and there is no paying 100% etc etc....   Basically the most Otani will be able to get from any one team is around 10 Mil so the total payout to obtain him would be a total of 30 mil in year one.

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1 minute ago, Stradling said:

This is one of those times where Claude is right in his, the player with a no trade clause has all the power. Where Stanton wants to play geographically is going to play a huge roll in where he ends up.  Especially when he has 10 years left on his deal.  

Yup - that'd definitely be the only hang up. Cards at least can offer a competitive team, great ballpark environment, and a strong org history, enough to maybe sway Stanton. 

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24 minutes ago, Calzone said:

True but Otani’s initial MLB contract will only be a short term deal. The team that signs him will have to plan ahead to extend him to a mega deal if he warrants it on the field. 

No more than they would with any other player.

Otani would essentially be a 2nd year player and can be renewed at whatever a team would want within the CBA's rules after his rookie season..  Dude could be renewed for the MLB minimum if they wanted and unless he gains Super Two status he wouldn't be eligible for even arbitration until after his third professional season in the US.   Basically all a team would have to pay him is the league minimum until 2020.... 

Once he's in an organization he will be no different than any player taken in the draft who finally makes it to MLB.   Its worth noting that MLB has already said they will take action if the team that signs him tries to get around the system by offering an obscene amount in year two, as a means of getting around the rules.

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Since the commitment is so long not just for the team but for Stanton himself, I think he will go to the team in the area, that he knows he will be either most comfortable, or offers the best chance of winning.  He’s a So Cal guy, so probably the Dodgers, possibly the Angels, we’ve heard the Giants, and I wouldn’t sleep on Houston.  

This sounds like a good bet.  Would you take those four, or the field, if you had to bet where he gets traded to?  

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2 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

No more than they would with any other player.

Otani would essentially be a 2nd year player and can be renewed at whatever a team would want within the CBA's rules after his rookie season..  Dude could be renewed for the MLB minimum if they wanted and unless he gains Super Two status he wouldn't be eligible for even arbitration until after his third professional season in the US.   Basically all a team would have to pay him is the league minimum until 2020.... 

Once he's in an organization he will be no different than any player taken in the draft who finally makes it to MLB.   Its worth noting that MLB has already said they will take action if the team that signs him tries to get around the system by offering an obscene amount in year two, as a means of getting around the rules.

Didn’t the Yankees trade some prospects to the A’s for Sonny Gray and also received additional international pool money. How does that play into it. It appears that the Yankees are putting all of their ducks in a row to sign some international prospects or even Otani. 

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2 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Since the commitment is so long not just for the team but for Stanton himself, I think he will go to the team in the area, that he knows he will be either most comfortable, or offers the best chance of winning.  He’s a So Cal guy, so probably the Dodgers, possibly the Angels, we’ve heard the Giants, and I wouldn’t sleep on Houston.  

This sounds like a good bet.  Would you take those four, or the field, if you had to bet where he gets traded to?  

I think Houston's in house payroll increases the next few years may keep them from making a move for Stanton.   They have a ton of arbitration eligible players coming -- and it gets worse in 2019.   https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KggX-IVrw6TywbOR6OIooQyxAY1MpTlnq88PqnNkuWQ/pubhtml

They may end up cutting guys like Gattis loose rather than pay them their third year arbitration money but -- as it stands now they are projected to have a payroll around 140 Mil going into next year and that's after ridding themselves of Beltran's 17 mil.

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17 minutes ago, Stradling said:

This is one of those times where Claude is right in his, the player with a no trade clause has all the power. Where Stanton wants to play geographically is going to play a huge roll in where he ends up.  Especially when he has 10 years left on his deal.  

The problem with Stanton is that he’s not an affordable acquisition for most MLB teams. He’s kinda tipped the scales with his current deal. So how many MLB teams can truly afford to take on his contract and shed salary at the same time. It’s not an easy thing to do.

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13 minutes ago, Calzone said:

Didn’t the Yankees trade some prospects to the A’s for Sonny Gray and also received additional international pool money. How does that play into it. It appears that the Yankees are putting all of their ducks in a row to sign some international prospects or even Otani. 

The absolute highest any team can pay him assuming they had the biggest possible pool to begin with and then were able to trade for the maximum allowable additional money is a little over 10 million (their starting pool and up to 75% more from incoming pool trades).  To clarify, that's not 10 mil for Otani -- that's 10 mil total for the entire signing season.     The Yanks signed 12 players already this year, including the numbers 4, 11,  20, and 28 ranked players -- the number 11 guy got 1 mil.. the number 28 guy got 500K.   So...  It's highly doubtful the Yanks will be able to offer the highest salary.

If this guy comes over, chances are he's going to a team or area he likes -- he will have to wait to make the really big money or hold off til he's 25 and avoid the current CBA rules for a player his age and with less than 6 years of professional experience.

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I think with every team you can find reasons they can’t do it financially, either current state of the team financially, like the Dodgers or the Giants.  There’s also the teams that we can explain away why they wouldn’t because of the risk of not being able to sign their own players, like the Angels or Houston.  But when all is said and done there will be owners who say screw it, let’s go for it.  Because to these owners with Billions have egos and if they lose a few bucks in the end it doesn’t really matter.  It’s a risk some are willing to take. 

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8 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I think with every team you can find reasons they can’t do it financially, either current state of the team financially, like the Dodgers or the Giants.  There’s also the teams that we can explain away why they wouldn’t because of the risk of not being able to sign their own players, like the Angels or Houston.  But when all is said and done there will be owners who say screw it, let’s go for it.  Because to these owners with Billions have egos and if they lose a few bucks in the end it doesn’t really matter.  It’s a risk some are willing to take. 

That's pretty much the only way my 'fantasy' scenario could become reality, is if Arte took that extra little step to go all in. He's sort of done it before so there is some precedent, and with the Trout/Eppler/Scioscia contracts ending in near future and a perfect storm scenario brewing with the Marlins, I think there's enough chance something could happen that it's worth discussing. 

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1 hour ago, Calzone said:

 

If Stanton was a left handed hitter the Yankees would be all over this. I think their focus is on Otani. If they don’t get Otani they will wait on Harper. Both are lefties that could rake at Yankees stadium. 

I don't see the Yankees as being players at all this offseason. Cashman has clearly stated that their goal is to get under the CBT now so that they can go back over it next year.

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16 hours ago, ukyah said:

you said padres. lolz.

Lol yeah, I initially was going to say what my chances for trading for Stanton for each of the teams I listed (LAA, LAD, SD), but then I felt I was rambling.  But I put the Padres at about 5% chance of trading for him, which is generous. 

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As some have said the real issue is where does he want to be among those who could actually swing it.   Unfortunately this also doesn't help us if he wants to win a title, which im certain he does, unless he just really prefers the Angels to the Dodgers for example as one is clearly closer than the other and may win one tonight.

This guy is tired of losing, wants no part of a rebuild, most here have been quite vocal about us being a barely 500 level team regardless of being in the playoff mix, well hes already got that in MIA, the two teams were virtually identical in terms of competitiveness.

Just one more reason i don't see it as realistic, would you want to come here if you don't want MIA? 

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1 hour ago, jordan111280 said:

Lol yeah, I initially was going to say what my chances for trading for Stanton for each of the teams I listed (LAA, LAD, SD), but then I felt I was rambling.  But I put the Padres at about 5% chance of trading for him, which is generous. 

5% for Padres?  I think you missed a decimal point and a zero.

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25 minutes ago, floplag said:

As some have said the real issue is where does he want to be among those who could actually swing it.   Unfortunately this also doesn't help us if he wants to win a title, which im certain he does, unless he just really prefers the Angels to the Dodgers for example as one is clearly closer than the other and may win one tonight.

This guy is tired of losing, wants no part of a rebuild, most here have been quite vocal about us being a barely 500 level team regardless of being in the playoff mix, well hes already got that in MIA, the two teams were virtually identical in terms of competitiveness.

Just one more reason i don't see it as realistic, would you want to come here if you don't want MIA? 

 

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35 minutes ago, floplag said:

As some have said the real issue is where does he want to be among those who could actually swing it.   Unfortunately this also doesn't help us if he wants to win a title, which im certain he does, unless he just really prefers the Angels to the Dodgers for example as one is clearly closer than the other and may win one tonight.

This guy is tired of losing, wants no part of a rebuild, most here have been quite vocal about us being a barely 500 level team regardless of being in the playoff mix, well hes already got that in MIA, the two teams were virtually identical in terms of competitiveness.

Just one more reason i don't see it as realistic, would you want to come here if you don't want MIA? 

The Angels could easily be seen as trending up. The Marlins are looking to clean house, it’s a completely different dynamic.  Do you really think that Stanton would veto coming to play for the Angels ?  I find that scenario more unlikely then the already unlikely possibility of the Angels going after him.  You’re being this down on the Angels is pretty unreasonable.   We aren’t the Pirates man.  

The contract is massive, and there’s a good debate to be had on whether it’s a good idea for the Angels to take it on or not.   

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1 hour ago, UndertheHalo said:

The Angels could easily be seen as trending up. The Marlins are looking to clean house, it’s a completely different dynamic.  Do you really think that Stanton would veto coming to play for the Angels ?  I find that scenario more unlikely then the already unlikely possibility of the Angels going after him.  You’re being this down on the Angels is pretty unreasonable.   We aren’t the Pirates man.  

The contract is massive, and there’s a good debate to be had on whether it’s a good idea for the Angels to take it on or not.   

That would depend entirely on what his choices are. 
Put yourself in that place, fandom aside, and you have a choice between us and the Dodgers right now, where do you go?  We both know the answer and it doesn't wear red. 

I'm not down on the Halos at all, i'm just not living in fantasy land.  

Not so much directly at you UTH but some guys here want everything both ways... all i read here is how the farm sucks, but somehow we have what it takes to make this trade?  Ownership wont spend money, but they will take on 300 mil?  Calhoun and Cron suck, but they would get us Stanton?  Some of you just want to argue for the sake or arguing and dont really have a point to make.

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