10 prospects ready to surge in 2017 (from mlb.com)

[Docwaukee]

http://m.mlb.com/news/article/212224800/10-prospects-poised-for-success-in-2017/

 

Jahmai Jones, OF, Angels' No. 2: Athleticism and raw tools, plus makeup, plus a feel for the game usually adds up to a future big leaguer. Jones has all of those attributes, and it started to translate on the field for him in the Pioneer League this past season. He got a late promotion to full-season ball and should be ready to take the Midwest League by storm in 2017, with a future as a speedy table-setting center fielder ahead of him.

[arch stanton]

Athletic 19year olds tend to get bigger and stronger. Seems short-sighted to label him a table setter already

[Oz27]

I'm still surprised by how many publications are ranking Thaiss ahead of Jones. I guess it is the old "ceiling vs certainty" debate and I know Jones' floor is much much lower than it is for Thaiss. But if things work out for Jones he has the tools to be a well above average major leaguer. I don't see how Thaiss has anywhere near that ceiling unless he can play a position other than 1B.

[Second Base]

Jahmai has the sort of elite athleticism unseen in our farm since Trout. We don't get super-talented guys like that too often.

[Stradling]

6 hours ago, Oz27 said:

I'm still surprised by how many publications are ranking Thaiss ahead of Jones. I guess it is the old "ceiling vs certainty" debate and I know Jones' floor is much much lower than it is for Thaiss. But if things work out for Jones he has the tools to be a well above average major leaguer. I don't see how Thaiss has anywhere near that ceiling unless he can play a position other than 1B.

I thought that publications looked for dynamic potential when ranking farm systems.  

[totdprods]

Not really sure why so many on this board are so 'down' on Thaiss. Numbers from his first year rival those that Cron and Calhoun put up in their first year. Thaiss actually climbed higher than Cron and Calhoun in their first year, and was a year younger than Kole as well.

30 extra base hits in 300 PAs with 26 BBs to 32 Ks is awfully promising. Very good blend of power and discipline so far.  

Thaiss and Jones are pretty interchangeable at the #1 spot on my list.

[Stradling]

I don't think people are down on him but just see him as pretty one dimensional due to his lack of athleticism.  Also people struggle to get pumped over Cron types of prospects.  

[eligrba]

Nice to see an Angel prospect being recognized.  Hope the pattern continues.

[Second Base]

1 hour ago, Stradling said:

I don't think people are down on him but just see him as pretty one dimensional due to his lack of athleticism.  Also people struggle to get pumped over Cron types of prospects.  

That would be the shortcoming of the consensus, because Thaiss is athletic, just in a more specific, less traditional way. When we think of athleticism, we think if a specific body type, that has speed, power and a grace of movement. I'd argue that Thaiss offers power, strong arm and high intellect.

Traditional athletes are able to adjust on the fly and learn new positions because their natural talent compensates for many experience based mistakes. Thaiss can adjust on the fly and learn new positions because he's smart, a hard worker and his bat and arm will play anywhere on the diamond.

It's splitting hairs, but the end result is the same. Many scouts expect Thaiss to be a 2B or RF in the majors. He's at 1B right now simply because it's an easy position to learn and they want him to focus on hitting.

[totdprods]

3 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

That would be the shortcoming of the consensus, because Thaiss is athletic, just in a more specific, less traditional way. When we think of athleticism, we think if a specific body type, that has speed, power and a grace of movement. I'd argue that Thaiss offers power, strong arm and high intellect.

Traditional athletes are able to adjust on the fly and learn new positions because their natural talent compensates for many experience based mistakes. Thaiss can adjust on the fly and learn new positions because he's smart, a hard worker and his bat and arm will play anywhere on the diamond.

It's splitting hairs, but the end result is the same. Many scouts expect Thaiss to be a 2B or RF in the majors. He's at 1B right now simply because it's an easy position to learn and they want him to focus on hitting.

Yeah I think it's a tad early to relegate him to a 1B only. He isn't a particularly big or overweight dude, but I could see him having a sort of Mitch Moreland-type positional versatility early on. His quick advancement displayed so far makes up for any shortcomings his defensive game or ceiling limitations he may have.

[Chuck]

2 hours ago, totdprods said:

Not really sure why so many on this board are so 'down' on Thaiss. Numbers from his first year rival those that Cron and Calhoun put up in their first year. Thaiss actually climbed higher than Cron and Calhoun in their first year, and was a year younger than Kole as well.

30 extra base hits in 300 PAs with 26 BBs to 32 Ks is awfully promising. Very good blend of power and discipline so far.  

Thaiss and Jones are pretty interchangeable at the #1 spot on my list.

I agree. 

[Docwaukee]

7 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

That would be the shortcoming of the consensus, because Thaiss is athletic, just in a more specific, less traditional way. When we think of athleticism, we think if a specific body type, that has speed, power and a grace of movement. I'd argue that Thaiss offers power, strong arm and high intellect.

Traditional athletes are able to adjust on the fly and learn new positions because their natural talent compensates for many experience based mistakes. Thaiss can adjust on the fly and learn new positions because he's smart, a hard worker and his bat and arm will play anywhere on the diamond.

It's splitting hairs, but the end result is the same. Many scouts expect Thaiss to be a 2B or RF in the majors. He's at 1B right now simply because it's an easy position to learn and they want him to focus on hitting.

was gonna write something similar but you've summed it up well. Thaiss is baseball athletic.  Eye/hand.  Looks like a ballplayer.  He's not basketball/football playing baseball athletic.  I think most equate that to raw speed frankly and sometimes it can be a bit of a curse when those 'athletic' types get to the upper levels because they have succeeded in spite of technique.  Jones won't have that problem because of hard work and really good make up.  

Thaiss can run and move much better than he's being given credit for.  I would love to see him at 2b or at least a corner OF spot sooner than later.  Maybe ends up a Logan Forsythe type on the high end or Steve Pearce on the low end.  I like the Kole comp with the bat, but Calhoun is an excellent OFer and I don't see that for Thaiss.  

Also, I think this is Mayo hedging his bets a bit and throwing a bone to people he's probably gotten emails from about why their guy isn't ranked in the top 100 when they are clearly performing better than player x or y.  

[Troll Daddy]

Good stuff! I could careless about the rankings. Looking forward to our future talent.

[AngelsLakersFan]

1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

was gonna write something similar but you've summed it up well. Thaiss is baseball athletic.  Eye/hand.  Looks like a ballplayer.  He's not basketball/football playing baseball athletic.  I think most equate that to raw speed frankly and sometimes it can be a bit of a curse when those 'athletic' types get to the upper levels because they have succeeded in spite of technique.  Jones won't have that problem because of hard work and really good make up.  

Thaiss can run and move much better than he's being given credit for.  I would love to see him at 2b or at least a corner OF spot sooner than later.  Maybe ends up a Logan Forsythe type on the high end or Steve Pearce on the low end.  I like the Kole comp with the bat, but Calhoun is an excellent OFer and I don't see that for Thaiss.  

Also, I think this is Mayo hedging his bets a bit and throwing a bone to people he's probably gotten emails from about why their guy isn't ranked in the top 100 when they are clearly performing better than player x or y.  

So you think he may end up as an 'every day utility man' playing all over the field? That would be excellent if he could show that level of positional flexibility.

[Docwaukee]

49 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

So you think he may end up as an 'every day utility man' playing all over the field? That would be excellent if he could show that level of positional flexibility.

only if his bat doesn't pan out as expected.  If it does, they will find him one spot and let him stay there.  I love the idea of giving him a shot at 2b, but my guess is that he ends up as a corner OFer.

[Second Base]

35 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

only if his bat doesn't pan out as expected.  If it does, they will find him one spot and let him stay there.  I love the idea of giving him a shot at 2b, but my guess is that he ends up as a corner OFer.

He's a little heavy footed, but then again, Alex Yarbrough and Brendan Sanger both played 2B and both started from a similar defensive skill set as Thaiss, though neither has his bat.

[AngelsLakersFan]

1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

only if his bat doesn't pan out as expected.  If it does, they will find him one spot and let him stay there.  I love the idea of giving him a shot at 2b, but my guess is that he ends up as a corner OFer.

That's probably true (re his bat having to not pan out), but it's great to hear that he seemingly has the physical tools to play a bit up the defensive spectrum. Given that, he sounds like an ideal third basemen. It seems like the team wants to fast track his bat the the big leagues, but what's keeping them from putting him at third?

[SlappyUtilityMIF]

Well, to be honest. GA was never thought of as a guy that could have tremendous power (though he hit usually over 25+) just a very nice short left handed swing. Everyone thought he would be a top of the order guy cause he was surprisingly quick.  

[Angelsjunky]

When I think of who deserves the #1 spot it is the answer to this question: If I could protect only one prospect on the farm, who would that be? For me the answer is easy: Jahmai Jones, and it isn't all that close.

This doesn't mean I'm "down" on Thaiss, just not as enthusiastic - and it is because of his similarity to Cron (and perhaps Calhoun). Another in the Trumbo-Cron lineage is nice to have, but not super exciting. Now maybe Thaiss can be better than Cron--I hope so--but until we see that, I'll happily take Jahmai first.

I also disagree with the notion that Jahmai has a "much, much lower floor" than Thaiss. Floor is often determined by make-up--meaning, players with poor make-up tend to have a wider range of floor to ceiling--and Jahmai has great make-up. I see his floor as being a very good platoon outfielder/fringe major league starter, which isn't all that great but isn't far from Thaiss's floor, which is Cron in 2014-15.

[Oz27]

10 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

When I think of who deserves the #1 spot it is the answer to this question: If I could protect only one prospect on the farm, who would that be? For me the answer is easy: Jahmai Jones, and it isn't all that close.

This doesn't mean I'm "down" on Thaiss, just not as enthusiastic - and it is because of his similarity to Cron (and perhaps Calhoun). Another in the Trumbo-Cron lineage is nice to have, but not super exciting. Now maybe Thaiss can be better than Cron--I hope so--but until we see that, I'll happily take Jahmai first.

I also disagree with the notion that Jahmai has a "much, much lower floor" than Thaiss. Floor is often determined by make-up--meaning, players with poor make-up tend to have a wider range of floor to ceiling--and Jahmai has great make-up. I see his floor as being a very good platoon outfielder/fringe major league starter, which isn't all that great but isn't far from Thaiss's floor, which is Cron in 2014-15.

While I agree with everything else you said, I disagree with the bolded section. Guys whose pro careers start in the same promising way Jones' has flame out at AA all the time. He is 18 and most of his career has been in rookie ball, so the gap between the floor and the ceiling is always going to be huge for a guy like that. Given the age and limited track record, that is an awfully optimistic floor to set.

[Second Base]

I ranked Thaiss over Jones because he's a ball player. While that seems like s poor reason, please allow me to elaborate. I've watched so many "athletes" fall flat in the minors. Guys like Ryan Bolden, Chevy Clarke, Travis Witherspoon, Jeremy Moore, Terry Evans.....all didn't live up to their potential.

But players like Thaiss who aren't built like NFL free safeties, and don't hit 500 foot HR's, and weren't first round picks coming out of high school, they have less room for error. They have to be very good to have come as far as they have and posted such impressive numbers. 

So for me, it comes down to, do I take a guaranteed Kole Calhoun, or 1/10 of a chance we have the next Jason Heyward? In this situation, I take the guaranteed Calhoun.

[Angelsjunky]

7 hours ago, Oz27 said:

While I agree with everything else you said, I disagree with the bolded section. Guys whose pro careers start in the same promising way Jones' has flame out at AA all the time. He is 18 and most of his career has been in rookie ball, so the gap between the floor and the ceiling is always going to be huge for a guy like that. Given the age and limited track record, that is an awfully optimistic floor to set.

The difference, though, is most of the flame-outs do so because of either poor make-up or chronic injury. Jones has great make-up and we can't predict the latter, or at least he's no more likely to become chronically injured than Thaiss.

I also don't agree, Scotty, that Thaiss is "a guaranteed Kole Calhoun." I would say he is a "likely Cron," a "possible Calhoun," with a slim possibility of being even better. But I do like and agree with what you're saying about him being a ballplayer.

The "athletes" like Clarke and Bolden don't work out because they rely too much on their athleticism and don't develop their skills. I see a much more determined player in Jones. And in fact, when you get an athlete with great make-up, you often get a star.

 

 

[Rico]

From catcher to second base, is Thaiss our Craig Biggio?  

[AngelStew43]

I am excited about Thaiss, Jones, Ward, and Marsh.  The first three we should see by 2019, Marsh by 2020.  It will be nice to frame Trout with some young talent.

[eaterfan]

1 hour ago, Rico said:

From catcher to second base, is Thaiss our Craig Biggio?  

That's what worries me and why I'm a little more in line with Oz. How many players have ever made the transition from C (post high school) to 2B successfully? I can think of Biggio and no one else. It's not impossible and I've never seen Thaiss play. I just think it's unrealistic to expect him to ever be an up the middle player. 3rd base could be an option, but once again, how many guys have mad the C to 3B move?

The most realistic options are still going to be 1B and corner outfield. The bat will have to play really well for you to be an average defender in the corner outfield and even more at 1B. 

If Thaiss can handle an infield position (besides 1B) then his ceiling is really high. If he's a corner outfielder his bat has to really carry him and it will limit his value.