Trout maybe the MVP again?

[AngelsLakersFan]

Interesting that in 2013 Donaldson was about as valuable as Miguel Cabrerra. He hasn't been significantly better this year actually, he's just tried some defensive value for a ton of offense, switching from Oakland to Toronto.

[AngelsLakersFan]

I personally believe that MVP should be given to the best overall position player, but most of the baseball writers give it to the person with the best offensive stats on a team that happens to make the playoffs.

 

It's funny, Trout was actually a better offensive player that year I believe, MC just beat him in average, homers and rbis, which to most baseball writers might as well be the only three categories there are.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

It would be a shame to see him robbed of another MVP. He clearly deserves it over Donaldson.

Donaldson's team has the best record in the American League, while Trout's spent much of the season scuffling to stay above .500.

[Guest]

I bet Billy Beane would trade Mike Trout if he had the chance. That guy is bonkers for trading Donaldson.

[QuinlansMinion]

Donaldson's team has the best record in the American League, while Trout's spent much of the season scuffling to stay above .500.

This logic is so stupid I wont even try to argue it.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

Yeah, it's pretty stupid to give the award to the most productive player on the league's best team.

[QuinlansMinion]

Yeah, it's pretty stupid to give the award to the most productive player on the league's best team.

Youre right, that is pretty stupid.

[Guest]

Youre right, that is pretty stupid.

You're being quite irrational for someone so hell bent on logic and reason.

 

Imagine if the Angels were in last place. Mike Trout, in this scenario, wouldn't deserve the MVP award. because the team is in last place with him, and would probably be in last without him which means he's replaceable. The MVP is awarded to the one player who is irreplaceable. There's a reason why MVPs don't typically come from last place teams.

Edited September 28, 2015 by failos

[QuinlansMinion]

You're being quite irrational for someone so hell bent on logic and reason.

Imagine if the Angels were in last place. Mike Trout, in this scenario, wouldn't deserve the MVP award. because the team is in last place with him, and would probably be in last without him which means he's replaceable. The MVP is awarded to the one player who is irreplaceable. There's a reason why MVPs don't typically come from last place teams.

Again, not even gonna bother with this.

Just read my original post, thanks.

[Docwaukee]

The criteria for mvp changes every year.  It's ridiculously momentum based.  

 

The baseball awards system is so all over the place and inconsistent.  

 

They have an award for the best pitcher yet the mvp can be either a pitcher or hitter.  The pitching award is usually given to the guy with the best statistical season.  Why don't they have an award for the best offensive player?  

 

It seems as if a player is head and shoulders above every other in any given year then they will get it regardless of playoffs.  Like Harper will this year and Arod in 2003.  Whereas if two players put up numbers that can be argued as to whose are better, the tie breaker goes to the guy on the better team.  

 

If the halos make the playoffs, Trout should get it.  He probably won't unless he puts up amazing numbers over the last 7 games, but whatever.  

 

There is no trying to figure it out.

[Inside Pitch]

Donaldson's team has the best record in the American League, while Trout's spent much of the season scuffling to stay above .500.

 

The Jays have 5 players in the top 40 for AL bWAR...  The Angels have Trout.   The Jays have 6 players that rank ahead of the second best WAR on the Angels -- Calhoun, and 7 position players in the top 50.   Then just for giggles the Jays have two pitchers that would also rank ahead of Calhoun.

 

So, the team with the best record in the AL has 8 players with a higher bWAR than the Angels second best player -- but you're right.....  Donaldson has been more valuable.

Edited September 28, 2015 by Inside Pitch

[19HALO71]

If we make the playoffs, Trout wins the MVP, Why? Because without Trout, the Angels are nowhere near the playoffs. With Donaldson, the Jays are still in first place. Especially following the other acquistions at the trade deadline. And let's face it, Trout is just a more popular player. Besides, Trout does Subway commercials.

[Blarg]

Or maybe that Donaldson was very consistant all season and didn't fall into a month long slump.

[zenmaster]

How many RBIs would Trout have if you stuck him in the 3 slot in Toronto's lineup? I'm sure there's a calculator out there for this. 

[Blarg]

Just swap the numbers for risp opportunities Donaldson had and use the same numbers Trout had in those situations for a rough estimate. This would just be conversation fodder because of random varience and park factors but it would be fun to see the rough sketch.

[bloodbrother]

The Jays have 5 players in the top 40 for AL bWAR...  The Angels have Trout.   The Jays have 6 players that rank ahead of the second best WAR on the Angels -- Calhoun, and 7 position players in the top 50.   Then just for giggles the Jays have two pitchers that would also rank ahead of Calhoun.

 

So, the team with the best record in the AL has 8 players with a higher bWAR than the Angels second best player -- but you're right.....  Donaldson has been more valuable.

 

Voters don't look at any of this though

 

They'll likely just see that Donaldson has slightly better stats(mainly RBI and runs....team dependent stats of course) and they'll probably prop him up a bit because of the Jays 2nd half surge. Donaldson is a worthy MVP candidate but I think the race really should be neck and neck. I have no belief that it will end up being close though and I think Donaldson ends up winning it handily

[Inside Pitch]

How many RBIs would Trout have if you stuck him in the 3 slot in Toronto's lineup? I'm sure there's a calculator out there for this. 

 

Well, you can compare the number of PA's with men on base....  Donaldson had 295 and he posted a .996 OPS in those situations.  Trout 258, and 1.013...  Looking at situations with RISP; Donaldson had 172 putting up a 1.055.  Trout had 122 and he put up a 1.222 OPS.

 

So basically, Donaldson had roughly 40-50 more plate appearances where he could have driven in a baserunner.  Donaldson has had a hell of a year.

Edited September 28, 2015 by Inside Pitch

[Inside Pitch]

Voters don't look at any of this though

 

They'll likely just see that Donaldson has slightly better stats(mainly RBI and runs....team dependent stats of course) and they'll probably prop him up a bit because of the Jays 2nd half surge. Donaldson is a worthy MVP candidate but I think the race really should be neck and neck. I have no belief that it will end up being close though and I think Donaldson ends up winning it handily

 

Yeah, I was just responding to the whole "he plays for the team with the best record in the AL" malarky...  

 

Donaldson's had a hell of a year.  I'd have less of an issue with Trout losing to him than either the Miggy seasons.  Donaldson can play defense, doesn't clog the bases up and he's been a tremendous presence in the middle of the Jays order.  But going off what they typical vote for -- Donaldson's big lead in RBI and the Jays second half rise which coincided with Donaldson's best month of the season probably makes him the front-runner for AL MVP.

[ten ocho recon scout]

Trout falling behind donaldson is on trout. Trouts had a great season, but his month long slump killed him. Im sure hes got a few more mvps in his future after this year though...

[Vegas Halo Fan]

I don't get the perception that if Trout doesn't get the MVP he was "robbed", either. 

[QuinlansMinion]

I don't get the perception that if Trout doesn't get the MVP he was "robbed", either. 

Hes carrying a team with a negative run differential to the playoffs.  Hes leading the league in OPS, OPS+, and WAR, with absolutely no help around him, and a guy with an OBP under .300 hitting behind him.  He has 40 home runs playing in a pitchers park.  Hes saved many games with his glove.  

 

Theres no question who the MVP is.  Its the idiots who favor RBI and team win totals who think Donaldson should win it.  

[Vegas Halo Fan]

Yeah, voters are idiots for considering what a player did for his team and not just raw numbers.

 

I remember posts here not too long ago questioning what had happened to Trout, since his production had tanked.

Edited September 29, 2015 by Vegas Halo Fan

[QuinlansMinion]

Yeah, voters are idiots for considering what a player did for the team and not just raw numbers.

Lol.  You just dont get it.  

[Vegas Halo Fan]

I don't get it? Well, thanks, Mr. Objectivity.

[QuinlansMinion]

I don't get it? Well, thanks, Mr. Objectivity.

Im firmly convinced youre too stupid to argue any points I make in any of my posts.  Instead you reply with some sarcastic comment which does nothing to help your case.