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Angels need to sell and retool


SoWhat

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I'd say it has regressed, but only because the graduation of talent this year has been really solid.  Our future 3B Kyle Kubitza, future 8/9 combo of Bedorsian and Gott, part of our future catching tandem in Carlos Perez, utility infielder Taylor Featherston and one of the best LHP prospects in baseball Andrew Heaney were all on the MWAH Top 30 and all look like they will have graduated.  Then there are guys like Tropeano that might either be with the Angels or be traded soon that might leave the list too. 

 

So in essence, the Top 30 gave the Angels their starting catcher, eventual 3B, utility infielder, starting pitcher and two bullpen arms this year.  

 

That's more than most teams get from their Top 30 prospects in any given year.  So we can keep complaining about the Angels lack of a farm system, but for the fourth consecutive year, they've been instrumental in providing the major league roster with young talent.

 

But yeah, after taking those guys off the list, you're right, it starts to look awfully empty again.  Luckily, the Angels went heavy on position players this draft, so we should see a few make something of themselves over the next couple years.  I'm looking at Survance pretty closely right now. 

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Sowhat makes some good points.  I don't see how the Angels can compete when you look at the future.  The Astros are for real. The Rangers are adding Hamilton, DeShields and Perez over the next three weeks. Hamilton should be back this week, DeShields in about a week and Perez around the All-Star break. That's significant power, defense, speed and pitching being added to a team playing as well as the Angels to date. I can't see the Angels adding that much and keeping up.  Then, Derek Holland should be back around the end of July or early August.

 

The Rangers might be interested in trading a prospect for a lefty specialist like Cesar Ramos to add to Wandy Rodriguez in the bullpen when Perez takes a spot in the rotation.  That would help the strengthen their left-handed bullpen pitching, which is their weakest spot.   

 

Basically, the Angels have one decent shot at the Rangers coming up, but they will be competing with a far better team the next time they face them. That puts them at a distant third in the Division, with little hope of a Wild Card spot.  Sowhat may be right that it's best for the Angels to retrench this year and beef up their farm for the future.

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The trade market is only now materializing, people dismissing a guy like Wilson's value are possibly going off half cocked -- perceived value and value to a team that thinks it's got a shot are two different things.  If Darwin Barney and his 66 OPS+ last year can net a team a prospect then anything is possible.

 

I think we are a couple of weeks away from the Angels deciding which way they will go but I'd be okay being a seller at the deadline if it means getting something for nothing.

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We're 3 back in the loss column, we're only really weak at LF and DH. Rotations fine, bullpens got the 7th-9th covered, just need a couple bats on the cheap.

But how many back in the win column are we?

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Sowhat makes some good points. I don't see how the Angels can compete when you look at the future. The Astros are for real. The Rangers are adding Hamilton, DeShields and Perez over the next three weeks. Hamilton should be back this week, DeShields in about a week and Perez around the All-Star break. That's significant power, defense, speed and pitching being added to a team playing as well as the Angels to date. I can't see the Angels adding that much and keeping up. Then, Derek Holland should be back around the end of July or early August.

The Rangers might be interested in trading a prospect for a lefty specialist like Cesar Ramos to add to Wandy Rodriguez in the bullpen when Perez takes a spot in the rotation. That would help the strengthen their left-handed bullpen pitching, which is their weakest spot.

Basically, the Angels have one decent shot at the Rangers coming up, but they will be competing with a far better team the next time they face them. That puts them at a distant third in the Division, with little hope of a Wild Card spot. Sowhat may be right that it's best for the Angels to retrench this year and beef up their farm for the future.

And all of those players coming back from injury should be OK. None of them will have any problems.

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Sowhat makes some good points.  I don't see how the Angels can compete when you look at the future.  The Astros are for real. The Rangers are adding Hamilton, DeShields and Perez over the next three weeks. Hamilton should be back this week, DeShields in about a week and Perez around the All-Star break. That's significant power, defense, speed and pitching being added to a team playing as well as the Angels to date. I can't see the Angels adding that much and keeping up.  Then, Derek Holland should be back around the end of July or early August.

 

The Rangers might be interested in trading a prospect for a lefty specialist like Cesar Ramos to add to Wandy Rodriguez in the bullpen when Perez takes a spot in the rotation.  That would help the strengthen their left-handed bullpen pitching, which is their weakest spot.   

 

Basically, the Angels have one decent shot at the Rangers coming up, but they will be competing with a far better team the next time they face them. That puts them at a distant third in the Division, with little hope of a Wild Card spot.  Sowhat may be right that it's best for the Angels to retrench this year and beef up their farm for the future.

 

Dude..  Get a grip.   "Basically" the Rangers are smoke and mirrors and not much else.  

 

People have been talking up the Rangers offense -- but their team OPS+ is 96, the Angels is 95.  Look at wRC+ and the Angels are ahead, 95 to 92 -- you can thank a hot May and unsustainable Babip that month for your runs scored being where they are.   They have had three SPs outperforming their periphs all year long and have no bullpen to speak of beyond Tolleson and maybe Kela who has been getting lit up left and right every time I tune into a Ranger game the last couple of weeks..    At least the defense got fixed.  Also ... what's the Rangers record .vs the AL West again?  

 

You should definitely be happy Holland and Harrison may come back -- ditto Perez, but two of those guys haven't pitched significant innings since 2012... the third has started all of 28 games in his career --  they are talented question marks.  

 

To date your "good" season has been equal to the Angels "bad" season.  Ranger fans have nothing to crow about.

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Dude..  Get a grip.   "Basically" the Rangers are smoke and mirrors and not much else.  

 

People have been talking up the Rangers offense -- but their team OPS+ is 96, the Angels is 95.  Look at wRC+ and the Angels are ahead, 95 to 92 -- you can thank a hot May and unsustainable Babip that month for your runs scored being where they are.   They have had three SPs outperforming their periphs all year long and have no bullpen to speak of beyond Tolleson and maybe Kela who has been getting lit up left and right every time I tune into a Ranger game the last couple of weeks..    At least the defense got fixed.  Also ... what's the Rangers record .vs the AL West again?  

 

You should definitely be happy Holland and Harrison may come back -- ditto Perez, but two of those guys haven't pitched significant innings since 2012... the third has started all of 28 games in his career --  they are talented question marks.  

 

To date your "good" season has been equal to the Angels "bad" season.  Ranger fans have nothing to crow about.

Dude is a troll. I'm pleased that the Rangers are .500 with 15 players on the DL but I don't expect them to make the playoffs. Also, their record against .500 teams is quite good while they've struggled against teams like the Mariners and White Sox. That defense that you keep mentioning is responsible for quite a few of their losses. 

Edited by sneaky_flute
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That's not how BABIP works. 

 

My statement was the Rangers offense has been marginally better than the Angels offense which most everyone here agrees has been bad, and that outside of May when they had 4 guys getting regular at bats post BABIPs over .360 they haven't been very good at scoring runs.

 

Run scored

 

April - 75 runs, second to last in AL

May - 158 runs, first in the AL

June - 91 run, ninth in the AL

 

BABIP

 

April - .249, last in the AL

May - .319, first in the AL

June - .311, 5th in the AL

 

The four guys who posted BABIPs over .360 in May scored 71 of the 158 runs.   When four guys combine to post an OBP near .400 for a month, amazingly a team scores runs.

 

Shocking, I know.

Edited by Inside Pitch
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Eric Sogard on our team is a lot preferable to the alternative. That guy is a thorn in our side.

 

Yes, removes the threat when playing against us, but what about his performance against all the other teams in baseball.  Not so good!

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I'd say it has regressed, but only because the graduation of talent this year has been really solid.  Our future 3B Kyle Kubitza, future 8/9 combo of Bedorsian and Gott, part of our future catching tandem in Carlos Perez, utility infielder Taylor Featherston and one of the best LHP prospects in baseball Andrew Heaney were all on the MWAH Top 30 and all look like they will have graduated.  Then there are guys like Tropeano that might either be with the Angels or be traded soon that might leave the list too. 

 

So in essence, the Top 30 gave the Angels their starting catcher, eventual 3B, utility infielder, starting pitcher and two bullpen arms this year.  

 

That's more than most teams get from their Top 30 prospects in any given year.  So we can keep complaining about the Angels lack of a farm system, but for the fourth consecutive year, they've been instrumental in providing the major league roster with young talent.

 

But yeah, after taking those guys off the list, you're right, it starts to look awfully empty again.  Luckily, the Angels went heavy on position players this draft, so we should see a few make something of themselves over the next couple years.  I'm looking at Survance pretty closely right now. 

The skeptic in me sees Perez as mathis 2.0 and Kubitza and Featherston as an AAAA guys.

Edited by Poozy
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Perez is better defensively than Mathis was, but what really made Jeff as unpopular as he was, was the hype he received as a prospect and the better option in Napoli.

Perez came without such hype and has no Napoli to compete against (yet).

Not sure where you're getting Kubitza being a AAAA guy from.

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Perez is better defensively than Mathis was, but what really made Jeff as unpopular as he was, was the hype he received as a prospect and the better option in Napoli.

Perez came without such hype and has no Napoli to compete against (yet).

Not sure where you're getting Kubitza being a AAAA guy from.

his high k rate, lack of power, underwhelming defense and less than stellar AAA numbers.

I haven't seen much of him though

Edited by Poozy
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I the Angels were adding DeShields, Perez and Hamilton the next three weeks, you would be ecstatic. But, they aren't.  Both are .500 teams at this point.  Only difference is that the Rangers have a great chance to get better with all the players they are adding off the DL.  Go look up what Holland did after he came off the DL last year.  The Angels don't have anything like that happening. I'm not trolling, just giving the facts and a status update on the season. 

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Perez is better defensively than Mathis was

This is simply untrue, or unknown given the small sample size for Carlos Perez. More importantly, it's another example of how you consistently fail to support your outlandish claims with some kind of proof (statistics/data/facts/sources). If you're right, then you're right, but when you make outrageous claims or pass off "insider" news, please do us the courtesy of including some kind of fact. 

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The reason I'd trade the few valuable trade pieces we have is to acquire prospects to flip for a bat in order to keep as many as those young arms as we can. The only other way to fix these holes is through free agency. Does anyone feel comfortable giving Heyward or Upton over $200M? Don't think so.

if those guys had any sort of value, why not trade them for that much need bat?

Oh, and i agree with everyone else.

no way in hell do we give up now.

We're 4 games back (3 in the loss column)of first place.

We're 2 games out of a WC spot.

WITH 86 GAMES REMAINING

i really can't belive this is even brought up

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if those guys had any sort of value, why not trade them for that much need bat?

Oh, and i agree with everyone else.

no way in hell do we give up now.

We're 4 games back (3 in the loss column)of first place.

We're 2 games out of a WC spot.

WITH 86 GAMES REMAINING

i really can't belive this is even brought up

Remember we live in a time where if you don't win it all then you suck.

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when HOU tied the game yesterday being down 6runs i was pretty deflated...luckily NY got their heads out of their butts to finish them off.  As shitty as we are...still battling to 500 with horrendous offense.  today against felix i felt the only one who had a chance at a hit today was navarro...that is a sad state to be in.

 

it seems since he has come up we are doing a little better.

 

looks like cole is back on track...maybe his outburst against johnG has got his head out of his butt. 

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if those guys had any sort of value, why not trade them for that much need bat?

Oh, and i agree with everyone else.

no way in hell do we give up now.

We're 4 games back (3 in the loss column)of first place.

We're 2 games out of a WC spot.

WITH 86 GAMES REMAINING

i really can't belive this is even brought up

But how many games back are we in the wins column?

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when HOU tied the game yesterday being down 6runs i was pretty deflated...luckily NY got their heads out of their butts to finish them off.  As shitty as we are...still battling to 500 with horrendous offense.  today against felix i felt the only one who had a chance at a hit today was navarro...that is a sad state to be in.

 

it seems since he has come up we are doing a little better.

 

looks like cole is back on track...maybe his outburst against johnG has got his head out of his butt. 

 

Navarro is a slight plus for the team vs. RHP for sure. He is a capable hitter against them. However we need two more left-handed hitters (or right-handed hitters that can hit RHP) to plug into the lineup.

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