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Ben Zobrist


santini1

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Zobrist is very good, but I wouldn't trade for him. Reason: the Angels have gone out of their way to full the utility infielder and second baseman spot by bringing in Rutledge, Giovotella, Featherston and Green.

If they brought in Zobrist it would basically mean we lost Jairo Diaz, a bunch of money for a Rule 5 slot and the RP sent to the Royals for nothing.

Not to mention the fact that this offense can't afford to lose Cron, who is a big part if their future as a cleanup hitter. They cant afford to lose Morin because then it's makes the bullpen much shorter now and in the future. They shouldn't lose Newcomb for a one year rental because right now, the future of this team's success is built on an eventual rotation featuring Richards, Shoemaker, Heaney, Skaggs, Newcomb and Sanchez.

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Yep, that would be like trading Dante Bichette for Dave Parker in 1990.

Yeah man.  Dante was a 5 WAR player......for his career.  

 

Do you realize how awful he was for milwaukee until he went to Colorado?  

 

Even with colorado he had a career ops of .892 which translated to a ops+ of 112.  Hamilton's ops+ last year was 114.  

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I'd love for the Angels to get Zobrist.  Include any of the potential 2B.  I don't think it would take a Newcomb.  Zobrist is 34 and has one year left on his deal, albeit a very reasonably priced year. Hopefully, they like Cron.  If not, I still think the Angels could get it done.  

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As far as bringing in Zobrist, it would just be inconsistent with what they have been doing.  Zobrist might be the type of player they add at the deadline, but not right now. As Scotty said, they made deals to turn the 2b job into a competition.  

 

I like Dipoto's knack for bringing in the lesser known player, but the fact that they have brought in so many players for one spot makes me think that they are not overly confident that any of them will turn out to be an everyday player.  It's kinda the opposite of the Calhoun situation.  He comes up and even in limited time gives the team enough confidence to where they feel they can trade two outfielders to fill other positions.  

 

Even though Green and Rutledge are likely the favorites, I've got a feeling that Featherston is gonna be the guy.  From what I can tell, he's by far the best defender of the bunch, has some decent speed, some solid pop, and decent discipline.  He can also play SS if need be.  What I've read also states that he's a leader with a strong work ethic and gets more out of his tools than he should.  Sounds like a Calhoun type to me.  I also think that because of his rule 5 status it makes the team inclined to want to keep him on the mlb roster as at least the util guy.   

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Can we get off the Zobrist love fest? We don't have the prospects to trade for him. We is the wrong side of 30. And we just brought in three middle infielders to compete with Green for 2nd base.

Trading for Zobrist by giving away our youth is is the reason we had no depth the past few years.

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Can we get off the Zobrist love fest? We don't have the prospects to trade for him. We is the wrong side of 30. And we just brought in three middle infielders to compete with Green for 2nd base.

Trading for Zobrist by giving away our youth is is the reason we had no depth the past few years.

We comfortably have the prospects to trade for him or pretty much anyone else in baseball. The arrival of guys like Heaney, Newcomb, Tropeano and so on means we could acquire nearly anyone if we wanted to. Whether we should or not is an entirely different question, but if we wanted Zobrist we could certainly get him.

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You'd trade Newcomb for a 33 yr old? That's nuts

to be completely honest with you, im not really aware of Newcomb and his potential and I dont mwan I would necessarily make this trade, just a hypothetical question of what it would take. Its like saying it would take calhoun and prospects for hammels but I would give that up.

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We got Heaney for one year of Kendrick. Kendrick is 2 years younger but isn't as good as Zobrist. He also makes $2 million less than Kendrick. 

 

Just trying to give you an idea of how valuable Zobrist probably is. I'd deal Newcomb for him with the depth we have now. Basically we will have traded Kendrick and Newcomb for Zobrist and Heaney.

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We got Heaney for one year of Kendrick. Kendrick is 2 years younger but isn't as good as Zobrist. He also makes $2 million less than Kendrick. 

 

Just trying to give you an idea of how valuable Zobrist probably is. I'd deal Newcomb for him with the depth we have now. Basically we will have traded Kendrick and Newcomb for Zobrist and Heaney.

 

and why would we do that?  maybe Zobrist/Heaney is a shade better than Kendrick/Newcomb going forward.  Maybe.  Frankly, I don't think so.  Doing this is taking a dollar out of one pocket and putting it in another.  

 

You can't think of this purely as a player for player deal.  As an org, the Halos wouldn't trade Kendrick for Zobrist straight up.  Their current production on the field is too close to call, but Howie has history here.  He has a fan base.   It's why I'd rather have Weaver than Doug Fister or why Pujols would be catching much less flack if he were still a Cardinal.  

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Yeah man. Dante was a 5 WAR player......for his career.

Do you realize how awful he was for milwaukee until he went to Colorado?

Even with colorado he had a career ops of .892 which translated to a ops+ of 112. Hamilton's ops+ last year was 114.

It's true that Bichette was aided by Coors Canaveral pre-humidor baseballs.

Mainly used the trade analogy from a trading a young player for an aging player viewpoint.

Bichette did have good promise, despite two very partial mediocre years here to start his career.

The real worry is being on the wrong end of:

Brock for Broglio

Bagwell for Andersen

Smoltz for Alexander

Figgins for Bartee

Ryan (and Stanton) for Fregosi (Mr. Angel but also on the decline)

Edited by Angel Oracle
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and why would we do that?  maybe Zobrist/Heaney is a shade better than Kendrick/Newcomb going forward.  Maybe.  Frankly, I don't think so.  Doing this is taking a dollar out of one pocket and putting it in another.  

 

You can't think of this purely as a player for player deal.  As an org, the Halos wouldn't trade Kendrick for Zobrist straight up.  Their current production on the field is too close to call, but Howie has history here.  He has a fan base.   It's why I'd rather have Weaver than Doug Fister or why Pujols would be catching much less flack if he were still a Cardinal.  

 

 

Kendrick had a career last year and put up a 5.4 WAR (Baseball Reference) and Zobrist put up his usual 5. Kendrick is usually a mid 3 WAR player where Zobrist is usually 5+. I would think Zobrist will be a win higher for the next few years. I'm not arguing that we should lock up Zobrist for 4 years after this season. Just offer him arb and try to work out a two year deal. Also Heaney is a much higher rated prospect than Newcomb and higher rated than Newcomb will ever likely be. He is MLB ready right now too. I'd think he's considered much better.

 

I wasn't using the trade as a purely player for player deal but just to shed some light on the value that Zobrist will probably get back in return and it's much higher than just Newcomb. If that were the offer we are getting a good deal. And running an organization based on sentimentality probably isn't the best way to win. 

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Zobrist would be a nice addition. However, I prefer the current direction that Dipoto is moving.  I can't imagine trading for Zobrist based on the cost.  The cost being not just the players but the loss of any perceived gains made to the farm system this offseason.

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Kendrick had a career last year and put up a 5.4 WAR (Baseball Reference) and Zobrist put up his usual 5. Kendrick is usually a mid 3 WAR player where Zobrist is usually 5+. I would think Zobrist will be a win higher for the next few years. I'm not arguing that we should lock up Zobrist for 4 years after this season. Just offer him arb and try to work out a two year deal. Also Heaney is a much higher rated prospect than Newcomb and higher rated than Newcomb will ever likely be. He is MLB ready right now too. I'd think he's considered much better.

 

I wasn't using the trade as a purely player for player deal but just to shed some light on the value that Zobrist will probably get back in return and it's much higher than just Newcomb. If that were the offer we are getting a good deal. And running an organization based on sentimentality probably isn't the best way to win. 

 

Not purely of course, but if things are pretty close then I think an org would rather keep the homegrown player.  

 

Granted, Zobrist has been better than Kendrick, but with their respective ages, I think the difference in 2015 is gonna be minimal.  And both Newcomb and Heaney are highly touted enough to where it's would be hard for me to consider one head and shoulders over the other.  Being 'touted' means only so much in terms of how they will perform at the major league level.  Neither have proven anything.  

 

Plus, we aren't getting zobrist for just Newcomb.  

 

So in the end, the overall exchange is about even for 2015 as far as I'm concerned.  Of course, that is arguable, but my point, more than just trying to square up these four players, is that if your net gain is minimal for both 2015 and going forward, why bother?  

 

I also think it would be inconsistent with everything else they have done.  Bringing in their slew 2b options tells me that Zobrist isn't on the radar.  If they had moved Kendrick and then made a run at Zobrist before adding Rutledge, Featherston, and Gio then I could have seen that, but now I just don't see it happening and would actually think it somewhat silly unless you could in turn move a couple of those guys for prospects.  

 

i think the Halos are pretty much done unless someone like Shields falls in their lap on a shorter deal than expected.  Or if an opportunity pops up to move Wilson or Hamilton in the right deal.  

All of those scenarios are very unlikely though.  

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