Angels Acquire OF Dan Robertson

[Angel Oracle]

Skaggs will be there in time. Having TJ surgery at 23 isn't the end of the world.

[Second Base]

I'll take a swingman or 5th starter on this team are you kidding?

 

I'm really not.  How many 5th starters or swing starters does this ball club already have?  Tropano, Santiago, Skaggs (once rehabbed), Rasmus, LeBlanc, Nate Smith, Tyler DeLoach.  That's 7 pitchers who profile well into a #5 spot or as a long-reliever.  Losing one in return for Robertson won't be a huge loss.  In fact, I'm willing to bet the Angels will probably lose a couple and get nothing back in return when all is said and done. 

[Glen]

there is no way they are trading from their 2015 pitching depth to get this guy. It'll be someone like Wade Hinkle

Maybe it will be Cory Hinkle.

[nikkachez]

I'm really not.  How many 5th starters or swing starters does this ball club already have?  Tropano, Santiago, Skaggs (once rehabbed), Rasmus, LeBlanc, Nate Smith, Tyler DeLoach.  That's 7 pitchers who profile well into a #5 spot or as a long-reliever.  Losing one in return for Robertson won't be a huge loss.  In fact, I'm willing to bet the Angels will probably lose a couple and get nothing back in return when all is said and done. 

No that would be tremendously stupid. You're talking about a team without very much pitching depth in the first place and you want to trade from that shallow pool? Tropeano and Santiago are the 5 and 6 starters right now. Fine. But you need a lot more than that. Skaggs is out all year so not sure why you even bothered listing him. Rasmus has never been a full time starter in the majors. LeBlanc is Wade 'Freaking' LeBlan we're talking about. Smith and DeLoach haven't even pitched in the majors. I'm willing to bet they don't deal from an area of lack-of-depth because that would be a stupid move. If anything, they'll want another starter. Tdawg hit the nail on the head. You think Jerry's sitting there and thinking "man we have too many starters, I'll trade one for a 5th outfielder"? 

[Second Base]

No that would be tremendously stupid. You're talking about a team without very much pitching depth in the first place and you want to trade from that shallow pool? Tropeano and Santiago are the 5 and 6 starters right now. Fine. But you need a lot more than that. Skaggs is out all year so not sure why you even bothered listing him. Rasmus has never been a full time starter in the majors. LeBlanc is Wade 'Freaking' LeBlan we're talking about. Smith and DeLoach haven't even pitched in the majors. I'm willing to bet they don't deal from an area of lack-of-depth because that would be a stupid move. If anything, they'll want another starter. Tdawg hit the nail on the head. You think Jerry's sitting there and thinking "man we have too many starters, I'll trade one for a 5th outfielder"? 

 

Name a team that has "talented" starting pitchers that are sitting 6th, 7th or 8th on their depth chart.  That's right, you can't, because there aren't any.  As far as 6th, 7th and 8th starters go, the Angels are rolling about as good as anyone right now.  Tropeano, ever look at his numbers?  How about his scouting report?  Have you ever watched him in person?  Not bad at all.  Cory Rasmus, how many #7 starters have his upside?  Please find one.  Wade LeBlanc has experience pitching in the major leagues so marginal success.  And he's only an option is 3 starters fall on the DL.

 

Our pitching DEPTH is fine.  It's the quality of pitching the Angels need to be looking at.  Someone that's a #3 or better.  Don't bother holding onto "5th starter" or "depth" guys because the Angels already have them in place and have even more on the way.  They're bursting at the seams with these guys, that's why you see Michael Roth being DFA'd.

 

Quality, not quantity.  You'd think Angels fans would be aware of this after the Tommy Hanson, Jerome Williams and Joe Blanton debacles. 

[tdawg87]

Jerome Williams? He was perfectly acceptable in his role here. Hanson and Blanton were acquired to be the 4th and 5th starters in the rotation, and then the Angels needed their 6th and 7th guys when those two shit the bed. I'm not sure what point you are trying to make there.

 

And this statement:

 

Name a team that has "talented" starting pitchers that are sitting 6th, 7th or 8th on their depth chart.  That's right, you can't, because there aren't any

 

is just plain false. Pretty much any team that has a wealth of SP prospects in AA-AAA has talent in their depth chart. The Nats, Red Sox, Twins, and Pirates, just to name a few. Guys who are pretty much ready to take the next step into the majors. How many of those do the Angels have?

 

The entire point of this discussion was not to say the Angels have no pitching depth whatsoever, but to say that they aren't exactly sitting pretty in that regard either. Trading away one of those pieces for a backup outfielder is just silly. I don't see how that makes sense in any situation, especially when its an area the Angels have some pretty good depth in to begin with. Trout, Calhoun, Hamilton, Cowgill, Boesch, Campana, and now they have Robertson. He will probably jump over Boesch in the depth chart but that makes him the 5th outfielder. Why in the world would a team trade solid pitching depth for a 5th outfielder when they already had one?

 

I think the fundamental difference here is that you believe the Angels have a lot of pitching depth, and I just don't see it. DeLoach and Smith are probably a year away from seeing any MLB time, barring any disasters, while Rucinski will probably serve as the 7th man behind whomever is seen as the 6th man. As it stands right this moment, both Santiago and Tropeano are in the rotation until Richards gets back. That leaves what, Leblanc as the main swingman? Eww.

[Second Base]

Yup, being 10 deep in the rotation isn't deep enough. We need to plan on 10 pitchers getting injured and no prspects coming up.

[tdawg87]

They aren't 10 deep in the rotation. Where are you getting that number? Even with Richards back they have like 9 pitchers and that's if you include Rucinski. Most of them are question marks. Some of them huge questions marks.

 

Richards, Weaver, Wilson(???), Shoemaker(?), Santiago, Tropeano, Leblanc?, Rucinski?? Alvarez????

 

You're probably counting Rasmus and I will once again reiterate: Rasmus has not pitched 5 or more innings since 2010. That's 4+ years of pitching in relief. He does not count as "SP Depth" until he has been officially stretched out as a starter. Him pitching 3-4 innings every 5th day doesn't count and we don't want to have to do that again.

 

Take out Rucinski if he was traded for a 5th outfielder, then you are down to 8 pitchers. This is assuming Richards is healthy and picking up right where he left off and Wilson hasn't completely shit the bed, forcing himself out of the rotation. 8 pitchers and the number 3 starter is as big a question mark as you can have in your rotation. Not exactly comforting.

[arch stanton]

I thin that's his point. These's plenty of arms but not the ones who can give 200 innings at the ML level so losing one of the swingmen isn't going to kill us.

[tdawg87]

No one said it would kill the team. It would just be stupid.

 

Trading him for a starting pitcher is one thing. Trading him for a backup-backup outfielder is another.

[Docwaukee]

I wouldn't trade any potential starters at this point.  The redundancy of the 3-10 guys makes every one of them necessary.  If any one of them stood out as being clearly more capable then you could justify trading one of the others but for now, it's just too risky.  

[Second Base]

I don't see the risk.  The Angels will likely lose Michael Roth for nothing.  He was one SP on the #7-10 depth chart and the fact that he was DFA'd just shows us the value these guys carry.  And for tDawg, this is how I see the depth chart:

 

Weav, Richards, Shoemaker, Wilson, Santiago, Skaggs (not until next year), Tropano, Rasmus, LeBlanc, Rucinski.  That's 10 deep right there.  

 

Now consider that both Nate Smith and Tyler DeLoach had great years in AA last year and that they're a couple of LHP that will be pushing for a spot by the end of the year and you're looking at 12 starters.  Sean Newcomb should be ready in two years, Ricardo Sanchez in three.  Then you have the wild cards in Kyle McGowin, Austin Wood and Victor Alcantara. 

 

The Angels were 4-deep in their outfield and that would mean Cowgill receiving everyday playing time in the event of an injury, which I'm not opposed to but I'm also not expecting spectacular things from.  Trading one of those 10 to be one more good backup OF deep is a GREAT deal.  Rucinski, good enough to be a swingman or 5th starter as he may be is redundant. 

 

If you're going to treasure the Angels starting pitchers, then save the passion for the ones that are mid rotation or top rotation guys.  We have 5 Rucinskis. 

[Docwaukee]

speaking of depth, I wonder what it would be like to get this guy out of colorado. 

 

He was DFA'd last week.  

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/n/nicasju01.shtml?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-www.mlbtraderumors.com

[Blarg]

Maybe it will be Cory Hinkle.

 

Maybe Corey Feldman, he was a 3rd baseman for the Bears.

 

[Second Base]

speaking of depth, I wonder what it would be like to get this guy out of colorado. 

 

He was DFA'd last week.  

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/n/nicasju01.shtml?utm_campaign=Linker&utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker-www.mlbtraderumors.com

 

He'd be an all or nothing pitcher.  But you know Dipoto likes his Rockies and D-Backs.  Nicasio is awful through his first 40 or so pitches, which pretty much rules out him being a reliever, despite the 3.48 ERA as one.  But once he settles in his walk rate decreases, he starts pitching rather than throwing and he's actually quite solid.  He just has to survive the first 3 innings.  If the Angels are able help him find some consistency, he could be a really good option.  Lord knows he has the stuff to succeed. 

[Docwaukee]

He'd be an all or nothing pitcher.  But you know Dipoto likes his Rockies and D-Backs.  Nicasio is awful through his first 40 or so pitches, which pretty much rules out him being a reliever, despite the 3.48 ERA as one.  But once he settles in his walk rate decreases, he starts pitching rather than throwing and he's actually quite solid.  He just has to survive the first 3 innings.  If the Angels are able help him find some consistency, he could be a really good option.  Lord knows he has the stuff to succeed. 

I always feel that Colorado guys with swing and miss stuff that get hurt by a lot of hits and hrs are at least worth kicking the tires on.  It's similar to trying to eval our guys at SLC.  Not only does the ball travel more once hit, but pitch movement is greatly affected.  Shoemaker is the perfect example where his best pitch was much less effective because of the altitude.  

[tdawg87]

Weav, Richards, Shoemaker, Wilson, Santiago, Skaggs (not until next year), Tropano, Rasmus, LeBlanc, Rucinski.  That's 10 deep right there.  

 

*heavy breathing*

[Second Base]

lol, when you have a pen as deep as the Angels do, having Rasmus go 4-5 innings isn't a bad option at all.  

[ettin]

If the Angels thought Nicasio could bring his old changeup back they might actually kick the tires on that one. Otherwise steer clear I think.