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Erick Aybar


Glen

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I can agree that Aybar ran left to avoid the fielder who may have ended up in his path. The problem I have is in doing so he ran into the guy with the ball. He chose wrong. It probably didn't affect anything but we are lucky that they made a bad call. There was no obstruction on the play. Just a runner choosing to go left instead of right and running into the ball.

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I can agree that Aybar ran left to avoid the fielder who may have ended up in his path. The problem I have is in doing so he ran into the guy with the ball. He chose wrong. It probably didn't affect anything but we are lucky that they made a bad call. There was no obstruction on the play. Just a runner choosing to go left instead of right and running into the ball.

 

The end result is he chose poorly but I don't think anyone can say the intent was to run into the guy that actually caught the ball.... It's a weird play.  If you believe his intent was to run into the guy with the ball, fine, I have no idea what he was thinking he may have well been trying to do just that..  But, I don't think that was the intent, I think he assumed the 1B would make the play based on how he was positioning himself to make the play.  Otero basically reached in front of Moss and caught it, not sure how a runner going full bore can predict that would happen and it's not like he had much time to decide..

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Had Aybar been called out, I don't think anyone would have a problem with it. By the definition of how you get outs in baseball, he was out. But, by calling him safe due to a obstruction call, this set off a chain reaction of events that disrupted the natural flow of the baseball universe. I hope the baseball gods don't screw us down the line.

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This is so stupidly simple of a call for the home plate umpire to make and he got it right. There cannot be two defenders in the path of the runner regardless if one fields the ball and makes the tag, the second defender, regardless if he makes contact with the runner is the obstructing player. It has nothing to do with which direction Aybar chooses to take, the extra fielder is obstructing the path to the bag. The two fielders were parallel with each other making a wall between them and the bag, one had to be completely clear of the path and was not. All other arguments are invalid.

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They were both there to attempt to make the play. Do fielders not have the right to attempt top make plays?

Also, why wasn't Aybar in his runners lane? That was completely open. The rules state the runner must be the runners lane unless he is jumping or sliding into the bag or unless he is avoiding a fielding player. He was not in the runners lane but was doing neither. Had he been in the runners lane he wouldn't have had to move to avoid the fielders as neither fielder was on the runners lane.

Also, please quote the rule that states that there can't be two defenders in the path of the runner. Thanks.

Edited by HaloMagic
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They were both there to attempt to make the play. Do fielders not have the right to attempt top make plays?

Also, why wasn't Aybar in his runners lane? That was completely open. The rules state the runner must be the runners lane unless he is jumping or sliding into the bag or unless he is avoiding a fielding player. He was not in the runners lane but was doing neither. Had he been in the runners lane he wouldn't have had to move to avoid the fielders as neither fielder was on the runners lane.

Also, please quote the rule that states that there can't be two defenders in the path of the runner. Thanks.

 

Yes, they have every right to try and field the ball but in doing so they cannot violate the rules of obstruction. If Moss had pealed off and cleared a reasonable path before Aybar reached that area then Aybar is out. But he cannot occupy the same place in time as the player fielding the ball and the base runner. 

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How would Moss have veered off? The ball was caught .2 seconds rbefore Aybar collided with Otero. Otero practically took the ball right out of Moss' glove. When Aybar changed course both fielders were still attempting to field the ball, thus both fielders had every right to be there. Everyone did. Oh, well, everyone except Aybar who should have been called out. And had he collided with the fielders before they made the play he should still have been called out for interference for choosing to completely avoid the runners lane, the path he it's required by the rules to run within, despite it being open the entire time.

Edited by HaloMagic
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The runner can create whatever "base path" he wants but the fielder's attempts to field the ball supersede such a path. Otero and Moss were never directly in front of Aybar until he veered to his left and collided with them.

this is not true. Aybar was called out for leaving the basepaths to avoid a runner obstructing the path in a scenario just like this less than a week ago. 

Edited by ScottLux
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Wouldn't the smarter move for Aybar be to keep running straight and crash into Moss? Moss was actually partly in the baseline and without the ball.The decision to veer into Otero makes it more than a discussion that I think it would have been if he ran into Moss without the ball.

Moss is a bit bigger than Otero and more likely had the ball. The reason for the Aybar collision with his mis because Otero collided with Moss. The problem, as Eric rightly points out is that there were two of them there, meaning one was an interference. Otero needed to back off out of the way and let the 1B make the play. That's really who was at fault, and that shouldn't benefit the A's. 

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Well, that is the unfortunate circumstances that the A's created for themselves by one player not calling off the other to field the ball. Their incompetence is not to be rewarded by the umpire call. They created the obstruction, Aybar only collided with it. That is the point you are not understanding, the defense's right to field the ball does not supersede all other rules that pertain to the offense's right to advance on a play. They violated the rules by creating an obstruction, that supersedes any action that follows.

 

How would Moss have veered off? The ball was caught .2 seconds rbefore Aybar collided with Otero. Otero practically took the ball right out of Moss' glove. When Aybar changed course both fielders were still attempting to field the ball, thus both fielders had every right to be there. Everyone did. Oh, well, everyone except Aybar who should have been called out. And had he collided with the fielders before they made the play he should still have been called out for interference for choosing to completely avoid the runners lane, the path he it's required by the rules to run within, despite it being open the entire time.

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Moss is a bit bigger than Otero and more likely had the ball. The reason for the Aybar collision with his mis because Otero collided with Moss. The problem, as Eric rightly points out is that there were two of them there, meaning one was an interference. Otero needed to back off out of the way and let the 1B make the play. That's really who was at fault, and that shouldn't benefit the A's.

Where in the rules does it state two fielders can't both attempt to field the same ball?

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There is none but for some reason your dim wit cannot understand that two fielders cannot tag out a runner trying to advance so one of them is simply obstructing the play. It has been explained a half dozen times, but it is obvious you can't grasp the concept that there is more than one rule in baseball and they follow in a stacked order of importance. The A's botched the play, they did not deserve the reward of an out call.

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There is none but for some reason your dim wit cannot understand that two fielders cannot tag out a runner trying to advance so one of them is simply obstructing the play. It has been explained a half dozen times, but it is obvious you can't grasp the concept that there is more than one rule in baseball and they follow in a stacked order of importance. The A's botched the play, they did not deserve the reward of an out call.

When Moss was in Aybar's way he was attempting to field the ball. By the time he was no longer attempting to field the ball (0.2 seconds before the tag) he was no longer in Aybar's way as Aybar had decided to go left.

So to recap, when he was in the way he was fielding. When he was no longer fielding he wasn't in the way. Where is the obstruction?

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The flipside argument is that Moss was in position to catch the ball, and Aybar yielded the path to him so he could make the play, then in those 0.2 seconds Otero decided to reach over in front of Moss and catch the ball.   If Moss isn't at fault for anything, then why would Aybar running full hilt be expected to account for a second guy reaching over and snaking a catch?

 

It's a pretty unique situation.  

 

As to the whole runner's lane thing raging back and forth between everyone, unless I've just never understood the rule at any point from little league through college ball, the runners lane exists to avoid the hitter getting in the way of a thrown ball.  A runner need not run in the lane ever other than to avoid being called out for interference on a throw...    

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Not that it matters to the ruling at all, but it appeared like Aybar had his head down initially and then looked up and both guys were in front of him, he reacted and it took him left. I don't think he thought about it and purposely ran into the pitcher.

Agreed. I thought he did it on purpose at first but after watching it enough it does appear like he saw them in his path rather late and had to make a choice.

It was wrong. No reason the A's should be punished for Aybar choosing wrong.

Edited by HaloMagic
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The flipside argument is that Moss was in position to catch the ball, and Aybar yielded the path to him so he could make the play, then in those 0.2 seconds Otero decided to reach over in front of Moss and catch the ball. If Moss isn't at fault for anything, then why would Aybar running full hilt be expected to account for a second guy reaching over and snaking a catch?

I don't think Aybar should be expected to do anything. No one of at fault. He's just out. Nothing wrong with that.

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Not that it matters to the ruling at all, but it appeared like Aybar had his head down initially and then looked up and both guys were in front of him, he reacted and it took him left. I don't think he thought about it and purposely ran into the pitcher.

 

If you look at that link I posted, he seemed to veer left then tried to pull up and veer right.

 

Just a weird play.

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