Can Freese or Ibanez break the curse?

[gurn67]

Is Anaheim really that hard of a park to hit in? Maybe it is since I can't blame Hatcher anymore. However, maybe Arte IS cursed.

I decided to look up who was the last starting position player acquired by the Angels during the off-season whose OPS actually went up during his first season here. I'm only considering guys who were a starting player for another team who were signed or traded for to be in the starting lineup here. I'm not considering guys who won a job in spring training, or due to injury. It's a really ugly list and all of these guys were acquired during Arte's ownership.

 

Year / Player / Drop in OPS

 

2013 Hamilton -.191

2012 Pujols -.047

2012 Ianetta -.055

2011 Wells -.187

2010 Matsui -.056

2009 Abreu -.018

2008 Hunter -027

2007 Matthews Jr. -.124

2005 Cabrera -.111

2005 Hillenbrand -.091

2005 Finley -.170

2004 Guillen -.079

2004 Guerrero -.023

 

Granted, Vladdy won the MVP, but the year before he missed pretty much June and July with a back injury and still had a higher OPS.

 

The last guy who actually increased his OPS during his first season here?

 

2002 Fullmer +.117 ...and we all know what happened that year.

 

[nate]

2005 Hillenbrand -.091

2005 Finley -.170

 

Hard to believe that team made it to the ALCS.  Vlad was a monster and Scioscia still knew how to manage.

[Second Base]

Freese will be fine. Back issues tend to linger but even the injured version of him last year was more of an offensive force than Callaspo. Many of the guys listed came over with considerable hype as FA signings. Freese doesn't have to worry about that with Trout, Pujpls and Hamilton. I expect a solid .275/350 30 DB 15 HR performance.

As for Ibanez, I don't think he's a starter anymore and will struggle. Scioscia loves his vets though, so that .200 batting average should carry him

Into August before he is replaced by Cron or Green.

[YouthofToday]

All of those players were old and on the downside of their career. That is the common link.

Since The Trade it is the Napolian Curse.

Edited February 21, 2014 by YouthofToday

[iiisenordingdong]

Is Anaheim really that hard of a park to hit in? Maybe it is since I can't blame Hatcher anymore. However, maybe Arte IS cursed.

I decided to look up who was the last starting position player acquired by the Angels during the off-season whose OPS actually went up during his first season here. I'm only considering guys who were a starting player for another team who were signed or traded for to be in the starting lineup here. I'm not considering guys who won a job in spring training, or due to injury. It's a really ugly list and all of these guys were acquired during Arte's ownership.

 

Year / Player / Drop in OPS

 

2013 Hamilton -.191

2012 Pujols -.047

2012 Ianetta -.055

2011 Wells -.187

2010 Matsui -.056

2009 Abreu -.018

2008 Hunter -027

2007 Matthews Jr. -.124

2005 Cabrera -.111

2005 Hillenbrand -.091

2005 Finley -.170

2004 Guillen -.079

2004 Guerrero -.023

 

Granted, Vladdy won the MVP, but the year before he missed pretty much June and July with a back injury and still had a higher OPS.

 

The last guy who actually increased his OPS during his first season here?

 

2002 Fullmer +.117 ...and we all know what happened that year.

I would be interested in seeing the same list for new players 1997 - 2002, that might show if it is the park.

[Inside Pitch]

I would be interested in seeing the same list for new players 1997 - 2002, that might show if it is the park.

 

Well, all one needs to do is look at OPS+ which adjusts for the park.   Using a park adjusted stat, Ianetta, Matsui, Cabrera, and Guerrero saw their performances improve.  It's also worth noting that after a drop in his first year, Torii Hunter completely blew away his career norms from his Minnesota days while a member of the Angels.

Edited February 21, 2014 by Inside Pitch

[yk9001]

Is Anaheim really that hard of a park to hit in? Maybe it is since I can't blame Hatcher anymore. However, maybe Arte IS cursed.

I decided to look up who was the last starting position player acquired by the Angels during the off-season whose OPS actually went up during his first season here. I'm only considering guys who were a starting player for another team who were signed or traded for to be in the starting lineup here. I'm not considering guys who won a job in spring training, or due to injury. It's a really ugly list and all of these guys were acquired during Arte's ownership.

 

Year / Player / Drop in OPS

 

2013 Hamilton -.191

2012 Pujols -.047

2012 Ianetta -.055

2011 Wells -.187

2010 Matsui -.056

2009 Abreu -.018

2008 Hunter -027

2007 Matthews Jr. -.124

2005 Cabrera -.111

2005 Hillenbrand -.091

2005 Finley -.170

2004 Guillen -.079

2004 Guerrero -.023

 

Granted, Vladdy won the MVP, but the year before he missed pretty much June and July with a back injury and still had a higher OPS.

 

The last guy who actually increased his OPS during his first season here?

 

2002 Fullmer +.117 ...and we all know what happened that year.

 

 

Those are mind-bending numbers, and quantify the general feeling I've had watching these crumb-bums come in here every year.  Thanks.

[Jim]

2002 Fullmer +.117 ...and we all know what happened that year.

I loved that guy. He had grit.

[fan_since79]

Two other factors:

 

Marine layer

Mickey "walks are a false stat" Hatcher

[NrM]

Ibanez will most likely be trash, but he's a low risk player.

 

I think Freese will be fine.

[fan_since79]

I loved that guy. He had grit.

 

Fullmer: best batting stance and swing ever!

[nate]

Also, most steroids.

[Hubs]

 

2005 Hillenbrand -.091

2005 Finley -.170

 

Hard to believe that team made it to the ALCS.  Vlad was a monster and Scioscia still knew how to manage.

 

 

They'd have won that ALCS too, if not for AJ Pierzinski and Josh Paul's phantom drop. I know the White Sox dominated after that game, but there is a huge mental difference between splitting the two on the road to open the series, versus coming back to Anaheim up 2-0, having to win just two of the next five games with three at home.

Edited February 21, 2014 by Hubs

[Angel Oracle]

Not to mention Lackey soiling the couch in the 1st inning of game 3.   They still had HFA at that point.

The starters laid eggs in the first inning of games 3 and 4, granted Erv the rookie was filling in for the injured Colon in game 4. 

That's where the ALCS was truly lost. 

[AngelsLakersFan]

Well, all one needs to do is look at OPS+ which adjusts for the park.   Using a park adjusted stat, Ianetta, Matsui, Cabrera, and Guerrero saw their performances improve.  It's also worth noting that after a drop in his first year, Torii Hunter completely blew away his career norms from his Minnesota days while a member of the Angels.

 

A lot of people don't realize how much better than expected Torii Hunter actually was with us.

[ten ocho recon scout]

A lot of people don't realize how much better than expected Torii Hunter actually was with us.

yep. Especially his last two seasons with us.

[Brent Maguire]

Freese should be fine. He's not a power hitter anyways so he shouldn't see a big change.

Ibanez is at an age where he could immediately stop producing. I'm hopeful that they can get just a couple of nice hot streaks from him throughout the year.

Freese should OPS around .750-.775 and Ibanez will be in the low .700's.

[laagamer]

Freese may bounce back, but I don't see Ibanez improving at all. Too old. 

[CaliAngel]

A lot of people don't realize how much better than expected Torii Hunter actually was with us.

 

Imagine how much better he would have been if he didn't make so many boneheaded mistakes on the basepaths.

[gurn67]

Normally, I don't like to bump one of my own threads. Also, I know it's only been 18 games of watching these two swing the bat. However, is there anyone out there who still thinks Freese finishes the season with an OPS of .721+ or Ibanez finishes with an OPS of .794+? Or, does this continual decline of veteran hitters coming here continue for season number 12?

[NrM]

Normally, I don't like to bump one of my own threads. Also, I know it's only been 18 games of watching these two swing the bat. However, is there anyone out there who still thinks Freese finishes the season with an OPS of .721+ or Ibanez finishes with an OPS of .794+? Or, does this continual decline of veteran hitters coming here continue for season number 12?

[markb]

Both of them are sporting pretty hideous peripherals right now.  Ibanez has no idea what a strike zone is, and Freese is whiffing at an alarmingly high rate.  Both need something to drastically change if they are to turn it around and become remotely productive.

Edited April 20, 2014 by markb

[ELEVEN]

I thought they were the curse?