Our #3/4/5 in a nutshell

[fan_since79]

These are career numbers.

 

 

Garret Richards:

11-13

ERA+ 86

1.430 WHIP

9.5 hits/9 innings

 

 

Tyler Skaggs:

3-6

ERA+ 73

1.371 WHIP

9.0 hits/9 innings

 

 

Hector Santiago:

8-10

ERA+ 126

1.358 WHIP

4.5 BB/9 innings

 

 

By comparison, Joe Blanton:

85-89

ERA+ 92

1.360 WHIP

9.9 hits/9 innings

Edited February 20, 2014 by fan_since79

[Stradling]

Would that nutshell be a clean peanut shell?

[tdawg87]

Holy sample size Batman

[Docwaukee]

It doesn't matter.  As things are set up right now, all 4 of these guys are going to get about the same number of starts in 2014. 

[SoWhat]

It's because of garbage like this I find myself on here less and less

[iiisenordingdong]

Further:

 

SO/BB

 

GS: 1.85

TS: 2.04

HS: 1.93

JB: 2.64

[fan_since79]

Holy sample size Batman

 

Exactly why they're question marks through and through. The three of them have 69 combined starts in their career. 

 

Some guys who went elsewhere and their career starts:

 

Garza 191 

Capuano 209

Jimenez 211

Arroyo 355

AJ Burnett 370

Edited February 20, 2014 by fan_since79

[iiisenordingdong]

Holy sample size Batman

Skaggs is the only one I see without an adequate sample size.

[Chuck]

Holy sample size Batman

 

You stole my post. Spot on!

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

How did guys "get away" when the Angels didn't even make offers to most of them?  I haven't been paying as much attention as the rest of you but aside from the Garza offer during the winter meetings I didn't hear about any of the rest getting attention from the Angels.  As stated many times Burnett was not coming to the west coast.

[Chuck]

It's because of garbage like this I find myself on here less and less

 

Well you need to spend your time making some new wallpapers for us in the interim.

[fan_since79]

How did guys "get away" when the Angels didn't even make offers to most of them?  I haven't been paying as much attention as the rest of you but aside from the Garza offer during the winter meetings I didn't hear about any of the rest getting attention from the Angels.  As stated many times Burnett was not coming to the west coast.

 Point conceded. I'm editing it to say "went elsewhere".

[Chuck]

FTR, the 2002, 2004, 2005, 2007, 2008, 2009 rotation wasn't all that great either. Coming into the season that is.

 

The best rotation we had coming into the season was in 2012 by all the so-called experts, including the fans. That rotation was not very good outside of Weaver and a first half of CJ Wilson, and a terrible bullpen, yet we won 89 ball games despite a month with a sucky Pujols and no Mike Trout.

[fan_since79]

Jerome Williams, 117 career starts.

 

 

[Mark68]

Exactly why they're question marks through and through. The three of them have 69 combined starts in their career. 

 

Some guys who went elsewhere and their career starts:

 

Garza 191 

Capuano 209

Jimenez 211

Arroyo 355

AJ Burnett 370

Garza is the only one who was even under consideration, and who MAY have improved this team, albeit in the short term only.

 

We were never, ever going to get Burnett.

Arroyo is old.

Jimenez would have been expensive and cost our first draft pick and the slot money that entails.

Capuano has about the comparable stats to those already mentioned, with a longer track history of being, in the official term, "meh".

[Inside Pitch]

Exactly why they're question marks through and through. The three of them have 69 combined starts in their career. 

 

Some guys who went elsewhere and their career starts:

 

Garza 191 

Capuano 209

Jimenez 211

Arroyo 355

AJ Burnett 370

 

Make sure to stick around and argue in favor of Scioscia the next time there is a debate about how he never goes with the young guys and prefers veterans.

 

Guy is young...  OMG, he's a question mark!  We need more experience

Guy is old.   OMG, he's a question mark!  We need a manager that isn't afraid to use young players.

Edited February 20, 2014 by Inside Pitch

[Jay]

not concerned at all.

[tdawg87]

Skaggs is the only one I see without an adequate sample size.

Joe Blanton has made 248 starts in his career across 1567 innings. Richards, Skaggs, and Santiago have made a combined 69 starts and have totaled about 400 combined innings. Even comparing them is absurd. If the point is to show that these guys are question marks well no shit. We all know that. But using their stats to compare is silly.

[SoWhat]

Well you need to spend your time making some new wallpapers for us in the interim.

I'll have a lot of free time for the next 2 weeks. PM me some requests

Edited February 20, 2014 by SoWhat

[tdawg87]

Make sure to stick around and argue in favor of Scioscia the next time there is a debate about how he never goes with the young guys and prefers veterans.

Guy is young... OMG, he's a question mark! We need more experience

Guy is old. OMG, he's a question mark! We need a manager that isn't afraid to use young players.

Angelswin only sees two levels: "Great" and "Terrible".

[avejoe1]

It seems stupid to compare Joe Blantons lifetime stats against these other pitchers when Blanton has clearly reached the rapidly descending, downward end of his career.  I prefer using his last years sample for comparison:

 

131.2 innings

Hits per 9 innings 13.6

Whip 1.61

ERA 6.04

Avg. against .317

 

Blanton no longer belongs in any discussion regarding the 3-4-5.

[iiisenordingdong]

Joe Blanton has made 248 starts in his career across 1567 innings. Richards, Skaggs, and Santiago have made a combined 69 starts and have totaled about 400 combined innings. Even comparing them is absurd. If the point is to show that these guys are question marks well no shit. We all know that. But using their stats to compare is silly.

From a pure statistical standpoint, 30 is an adequate sample size. I view it as innings pitched/6 to to calculate length of a start. I don't think the stats themselves prove anything, just a conversation starter.

[Inside Pitch]

Most saber types tend to agree it's bad to use career numbers for young and old players.  Young players are often finding their way, older players are falling off their established level of performance, in many cases the track records aren't indicative of what the player is capable of moving forward. The younger guys are definitely question marks -- but they are also "break out" candidates.   Skaggs minor league track record is a reason for optimism, as was Richards' second half in the rotation.  I'm curious to see how Santiago does since he's the guy I know least about and barely seen throw.

 

I'm not thrilled about the lack of depth, it's a legit concern for me but I do like that at least there is a reason to expect better from the younger pitchers that isn't based on them coming back from injury or having a bounce back season after a bad year.  I still think they will likely add an arm...  I'm not expecting a trade at all, but I do imagine that someone may not accept a minor league assignment elsewhere and that the Angels may try to pick a guy up that way.

[QuinlansMinion]

FTR, the 2002, 2004, 2005, 2007, 2008, 2009 rotation wasn't all that great either. Coming into the season that is.

 

The best rotation we had coming into the season was in 2012 by all the so-called experts, including the fans. That rotation was not very good outside of Weaver and a first half of CJ Wilson, and a terrible bullpen, yet we won 89 ball games despite a month with a sucky Pujols and no Mike Trout.

Great post!

 

I find it funny how quickly some people write off our rotation.  Its like they have never watched an MLB season unfold.  

We have 3 young starters who have potential to be great consistent starters.  There is no point in speculating and analyzing career numbers for 3 guys who could be a hit or miss.  I would rather have the 3 guys we have now who could potentially pan out then throw guys like Blanton out there who you already know are garbage.  I would be more worried about the offense coming through.  If the offense doesnt perform as expected were screwed regardless of our rotation.

[Mark68]

Most saber types tend to agree it's bad to use career numbers for young and old players.  Young players are often finding their way, older players are falling off their established level of performance, in many cases the track records aren't indicative of what the player is capable of moving forward. The younger guys are definitely question marks -- but they are also "break out" candidates.   Skaggs minor league track record is a reason for optimism, as was Richards' second half in the rotation.  I'm curious to see how Santiago does since he's the guy I know least about and barely seen throw.

 

I'm not thrilled about the lack of depth, it's a legit concern for me but I do like that at least there is a reason to expect better from the younger pitchers that isn't based on them coming back from injury or having a bounce back season after a bad year.  I still think they will likely add an arm...  I'm not expecting a trade at all, but I do imagine that someone may not accept a minor league assignment elsewhere and that the Angels may try to pick a guy up that way.

Time to start delving into the "who is likely to get DFA'd" reports.

Edited February 20, 2014 by Mark68